Public Money by right - direct experiences please!

[PANICPASS]

Pardon me, but did you have something to add to this thread PANICPASS, concerning experiences with public money?

Yes, I did add something to this thread. I responded to DM's post above regarding taxes and tax forms, and refunds.

I understand that some subscribers here like to try and offend fellow subscribers. Please offer proof with your rebuttal. I thought the purpose of this thread was to explore this concept.

Did I offend someone? Who did I offend?

Would you agree to keep this a debate using some site information if you disagree? Or do you consider this request unfair?

I disagreed and used site information. Tax forms need not be signed if you are not an employee, officer of the United States. That information can be researched at 1215.org in the article entitled Jurisdiction.

[mnchicago]

From David Merrill:

But it is constitutional for Congress to set up a
private credit system with the central bank - the
Federal Reserve System. Nations have been doing that
for several centuries now.

And it is constitutional for that central bank to issue
currency upon the bond of any party who desires it
voluntarily.

You must have a specific reason for stating the above,
David, but it escapes me.

The first sentence is patently false. The FED is
unconstitutional right out of the gate. Its board members
are not elected, yet they control a private bank of issue.
This displaces Congressional mandate re our currency.
Egro, unconstitutional, and there are other reasons.

The second sentence is non sequitur based on the first.

Sorry to see this thread lose its intent.

Cheers!

[PANICPASS]

Here is the link where DM gets his information:

http://www.wealth4freedom.com/money/nod.htm

You can't talk about public money without talking about tax forms because you don't get a paycheck without a tax form. Paychecks, tax forms and public money go together like a horse, carriage and marriage. Which comes first: the paycheck, the tax form or the public money? You gotta deal with what comes first - The tax form.

[David Merrill]

Originally Posted by PANICPASS

You may be right - however that defeats the purpose of calling it withholdings.

The W-4 is an Employee's Withholding Allowance Certificate. You don't claim withholdings. You clam allowances.

When you sign the W-4 "under penalties of perjury" you allow withholding. What those withholdings are are a mystery. You can call them what you want on the form but if you anticipate no taxable events, you need not sign the form. If you are an employee or officer of the United States, then you are required to sign the form.


I believe you are just making a nonsense argument for the sake of argument. - For the sake of boring the Readers off the point that they can exercise their right to public money according to the article.

I think you are causing undue troubles ahead for many the readers. I'm sorry so many people read your nonsense and believe it.

Now I get it. You are right. The trouble is that employers will not hire you or fire you if you refuse to sign the W4 Form. Or at best the corporate attorney calls the IRS and an agent just tells him to keep full withholdings.

Your point is moot considering you could just use the stamp above the signature on the W4 Form to defeat whatever point it is you are trying to make. You are off base to tell me that I am wrong because I called allowances exemptions.

Is that Judge Roy Bean you quoted? Good call PANICPASS.


Regards,

David Merrill.

[David Merrill]

Originally Posted by mnchicago

From David Merrill:

But it is constitutional for Congress to set up a
private credit system with the central bank - the
Federal Reserve System. Nations have been doing that
for several centuries now.

And it is constitutional for that central bank to issue
currency upon the bond of any party who desires it
voluntarily.

You must have a specific reason for stating the above,
David, but it escapes me.

The first sentence is patently false. The FED is
unconstitutional right out of the gate. Its board members are not elected, yet they control a private bank of issue. This displaces Congressional mandate re our currency. Egro, unconstitutional, and there are other reasons.

The second sentence is non sequitur based on the first.

Sorry to see this thread lose its intent.

Cheers!

It would be unconstitutional to make people handle Federal Reserve Notes. People have a right to use US Notes and can do it - specify non-negotiable FRNs.


The W4 Form sets up an account for withholdings. PANICPASS seems determined to call the funds a mystery but do not let that foil your understanding. It does not take a brilliant mind to understand the W4 and withholdings.


Regards,

David Merrill.

[Smith]

The w-4 is optional under us26 3402p of the tax code .

Under us 26 3402n I have the right to claim exempt,but any employer will call the IRS and screw you over.

I had it happen ...was experimenting and it did not work .

I do understand the rational behind this discusion though.

public money VS private credit

and I do agree that credit is not taxable

and public money doesn't exist so you should be tax free in theory.

But history has shown us that the laws of our nation will continue to be missapplied.

[PANICPASS]

Your point is moot considering you could just use the stamp above the signature on the W4 Form to defeat whatever point it is you are trying to make. You are off base to tell me that I am wrong because I called allowances exemptions.



The stamp is a contradiction to what you just signed. When you sign a W-4 you make a claim. A claim is a right. When you sign the W-4 you claim value for rights to receive credit.

I did a google search for the word 'value' and google brought it up in Wikipedia:

It says:

"Under the Uniform Commercial Code, except with respect to Article 3, a person gives value for rights if he acquires them in exchange for:

1. a binding commitment to extend credit or for the extension of immediately available credit;

2. as security for or in total or partial satisfaction of a preexisting claim;

3. accepting delivery pursuant to a preexisting contract for purchase;

4. generally, any consideration sufficient to support a simple contract.


Read line 5 and line 7 on the W-4. Line 5 says, Total number of allowances you are claiming, and line 7 says I claim exemption from withholding.

You can't make a claim for credit and also make a claim for public money. Which one is it? The IRS will tell you which one.

[PANICPASS]

The W4 Form sets up an account for withholdings. PANICPASS seems determined to call the funds a mystery but do not let that foil your understanding.


The funds are no longer a mystery. They are credits. Credits to your SSN/IRS account.

[David Merrill]

Originally Posted by Smith

...and public money doesn't exist so you should be tax free in theory.

Yes! Public money does exist; in the form of Federal Reserve Notes.

[David Merrill]

Originally Posted by PANICPASS

The W4 Form sets up an account for withholdings. PANICPASS seems determined to call the funds a mystery but do not let that foil your understanding.


The funds are no longer a mystery. They are credits. Credits to your SSN/IRS account.

Indeed! And those credits become due when you have no taxable events on your total income. When you send in the withholdings (or when your employer sends) you are not paying the income tax. You file a 1040 Return as required on all the private credit you have gotten over the tax year from the Federal Reserve by cashing paychecks for private credit. If you have more withholdings that private credit accrued you get a Refund.

Now suppose you requested no private credit when cashing paychecks over the tax year? You have zero taxable income. So you file a 1040 Form with zero taxable events honestly reported and you should get a Refund of all the withholdings. I do not see what is so difficult to understand about that.

However I think you have made the point eloquently, that the W4 and the entire concept of withholdings is based on the assumption the employee wants to engage in the Federal Reserve's private credit.



Regards,

David Merrill.