Banks, Collectors, and CRAs Discuss the elimationa of secured and unsecured "debt", as well as tactics for dealing with debt collectors and credit reporting agencies.


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  #21  
Old 07-28-2004, 02:47 AM
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Cites - Case Law Prohibitions on Banking

Sadie,



Take a look at Cornforths material regarding void judgments... and check the banking laws in regards to the loan. But ... I believe that you would have faired much better had you left any sort of redemption argument out of this and concentrated on the "agreement".



They totally did not do as they agreed... and that is how this issue should be approached. Your intent was to take out a "loan"... and that isn't what happened even though the bank represented and advertised that.



You may want to seek an "injunction" of some sort to stop any "writ of assistance" that might be used in order to get the sheriff to remove you from the home... and you may want to appeal any issues that you raised that were not dealt with properly during the course of the "trial".



Your motion to vacate... if kept simple... would be a good bet though.



Ice
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  #22  
Old 07-28-2004, 04:36 AM
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Sadie,



Have you looked into judcial notice? check the FRE on this.



If this does not work (which it should if you put it on record)--look into a writ of mandamus and file it with the district court against the judge. Consider this:



“There is a canon of legislative construction which teaches Congress that, unless a contrary intent appears [legislation] is meant to apply only within territorial jurisdiction of the United States.”

U.S. v. Spelar, 338 U.S. 217 at 222 (1949)



“the United States never held any municipal sovereignty, jurisdiction, or right of soil in Alabama or any of the new states which were formed ... The United States has no Constitutional capacity to exercise municipal jurisdiction, sovereignty or eminent domain, within the limits of a state or elsewhere, except in the cases in which it is expressly granted ...”

Pollard v. Hagan, 44 U.S. 213, 221, 223 (1845)



“... the states are separate sovereigns with respect to the federal government”

Heath v. Alabama, 474 U.S. 82 (1985)



“No sanction can be imposed absent proof of jurisdiction” [Stanard v. Olesen, 74 S. Ct.768]



"...Federal jurisdiction cannot be assumed, but must be clearly shown." Brooks v. Yawkey, 200 F.2d 633



"Jurisdiction is essential to give validity to the determinations of administrative agencies and where jurisdictional requirements are not satisfied, the action of the agency is a nullity..." City Street Improv. Co. v. Pearson, 181 C 640, 185 P. 962; O'Neill v. Dept of Professional & Vocational Standards, 7 CA2d 393, 46 P2d 234



“Once challenged, jurisdiction cannot be ‘assumed’, it must be proved to exist.” [Stuck v. Medical Examiners, 94 Ca2d 751.211 P2s 389]



"The law requires PROOF OF JURISDICTION to appear on the Record of the administrative agency and all administrative proceedings." Hagans v. Lavine, 415 U.S. 533 (1974)



"Therefore, it is necessary that the record present the fact establishing the jurisdiction of the tribunal." Lowe v. Alexander 15C 296; People v. Board of Delegates of S.F. Fire Dept., 14 C 479



"A Justice's Court is an inferior court, and its jurisdiction must be shown affirmatively by a party relying upon, or claiming any right under, its judgments." Jolley v. Foltz (1867), C. 321.



"If any tribunal (court) finds absence of proof of jurisdiction over person and subject matter, the case must be dismissed." Louisville RR v. Motley, 211 U.S. 149, 29 S.Ct. 42 (1908)



"A judgment is absolutely void if it appears that there was a want of jurisdiction in the court rendering it either of the subject matter or the person of the defendant." Hahn v. Morse (1868), C. 391.



"An officer who acts in violation of the Constitution ceases to represent the government." Brookfield Const. Co. v. Stewart, 284 F.Supp. 94.



"Judges not only can be sued over their official acts, but could be held liable for injunctive and declaratory relief and attorney's fees." Lezama v. Justice Court, A025829.



"Our own experience is fully consistent with the common law's rejection of a rule of judicial immunity from prospective relief. We never have had a rule of absolute judicial immunity from prospective relief, and there is no evidence that the absence of that immunity has had a chilling effect on judicial independence." Pulliam v. Allen, 466 U.S. 522, 104 S.Ct. 1970 (1984); cited in Lezama v. Justice Court, A025829.



"Judge acted in the face of clearly valid statutes or case law expressly depriving him of (personal) jurisdiction would be liable." Dykes v. Hosemann, 743 F.2d 1488 (1984).



I think this is the direction you should look into if the judge does not adhere to judicial notice. I am most certain that they did not establish jurisdiction. Kind a step back and stop arguing a little and look more into taking control through the judge. Put it on the record.



Hope that helps.
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  #23  
Old 07-28-2004, 08:25 AM
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Cites - Case Law Prohibitions on Banking

Ice and Jerseee



Thanks for all the great info.



Ice



I don't even know what redemption process is but it appears to have something to do with UCC.





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not legal advice - just my 2 cents (not lawful money)
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  #24  
Old 07-28-2004, 08:40 AM
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And we highly recommend you avoid it and stick to the law. The soveriegn's true remedy in this nation.
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Old 07-28-2004, 10:41 AM
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In my cases this is what happened.



Send letter to Dispute the account asking for documents of the alleged debt. Requesting ceritifed verifiable documents.... with FDCPA and FCBA language.

Presettlement notice with abritration language

Settlement $10.00 arbitration clause etc.. with other l anguage of agreement that I owed nothing in original.



Result possible arbritration if they don't follow the settlement agreement. Which they always cash. Usually they drop the whole thing.





I have had two sent to local courts. Started discovery and questioned jurisdiction as it was a Federal issue not a state issue due to original Dispute with FDCPA and FCBA. Lawyer has not heard from them in over a year.

Note: the arbitration clause is fairly new and has not been used by me as of yet as I have not had to. $250 retainer fees on the case.

This accounts for 10 credit cards.



This has been my experience!

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Old 07-28-2004, 11:05 AM
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Luke,



Thanks for sharing your experience but, there is one place you went wrong....you argued (disputed) an alleged debt. Big No No
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Old 07-28-2004, 11:13 AM
LUKE2447 LUKE2447 is offline
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Yeah I know Jersee and I understand the point. Most of this was before finding more info. It has worked so far without any problems as most 3rd party people just go away. After a couple of letters.
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  #28  
Old 07-28-2004, 11:15 AM
LUKE2447 LUKE2447 is offline
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Also The dispute does force them to give evidence from what I have seen and of course they refuse to give such evidence. I undertand your point and agree. I am just using the law as I know it with offer of compromise (settlement agreement) You would have to read the papers first I guess.
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Old 07-28-2004, 11:26 AM
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Gotcha.
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  #30  
Old 07-28-2004, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerseee
And we highly recommend you avoid it and stick to the law. The soveriegn's true remedy in this nation.
As if "redemption" doesn't use the "law". From what I've seen, it does. Just not the way some think it should be used. I'm currently trying out something involving "redemption" and will post the results.
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