auto loan title

[Ice]

By any chance, do they have any proof that you agreed to this "account" they opened for ya? ... They got some kind of contract that states you agree to this account they opened?



It sounds to me like someone is just willy nilly creating accounts in your name. I'd see about that if I were you.

[seeker]

Ice;



I think you may be onto something -- I saw something similar when my first CR came back -- it appeared that each time a certain company "extended an invitation" for a loan/CC they initiated an account. These accounts wer listed as open and had a Credit Limt attached -- in my humble opinion -- I think the CCC issue the :credit limit" as the "loan" so they can use that to create their money -- just my take on it --

Those accounts all went away when I requested they be validated -- hmmm.



seeker

Originally Posted by Ice

By any chance, do they have any proof that you agreed to this "account" they opened for ya? ... They got some kind of contract that states you agree to this account they opened?



It sounds to me like someone is just willy nilly creating accounts in your name. I'd see about that if I were you.

MAN YOU'RE GOOD!!! YOU JUST GAVE ME MORE AMMO.

I GUESS THE SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR JUST DECIDED TO CREATE A NEW ACCT. # HOPING THAT I WOULD REFERENCE IT IN MY CORRESPONDANCE.



I WILL JUST STICK TO THE ORIGINAL ALLEGED DEBT

ACCOUNT BUT WILL SURE GIVE THE SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR A HARD TIME ABOUT THEIR NEWLY CREATED NUMBER.



GOOD STUFF DUDE!!!

Originally Posted by seeker

Ice;



I think you may be onto something -- I saw something similar when my first CR came back -- it appeared that each time a certain company "extended an invitation" for a loan/CC they initiated an account. These accounts wer listed as open and had a Credit Limt attached -- in my humble opinion -- I think the CCC issue the :credit limit" as the "loan" so they can use that to create their money -- just my take on it --

Those accounts all went away when I requested they be validated -- hmmm.



seeker

SEEKER,

YOU'RE CORRECT. THE CREDIT LIMIT IS THE "LOAN"

BTW, ARE YOU SAYING THAT YOU HAD CC ACCOUNTS OPEN WITHOUT YOUR AUTHORIZATION?

[seeker]

PJ;



Complete mystery to me where they came from. I never saw any cards, loans, etc from the companies that had accounts listed! When questioned, the CRA removed them all ---



seeker

[Ice]

Someone perpetrated a fraud upon your commercial person... if those bogus accounts had ever interferred with any other transaction you may have attempted you may have been able to state a claim for damages.

HERE'S THE LATEST ON MY AUTO LOAN SAGA:

AFTER MONTHS AND MONTHS OF BACK AND FORTH WITH THE SO CALLED SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR, THEY FINALLY DECIDED TO CALL A REPOMAN.



OF COURSE I NEVER RECEIVED ANY RESPONSE TO MY LETTERS REGARDING VALIDATION OR REQUEST TO SEE ORIGINAL CONTRACT OR PROMISSORY NOTE.



MY QUESTION IS: SHOULD I EVEN RESPOND TO THE REPODUDE? ANY SUGGESTIONS ON NEXT STEPS TO FOLLOW?

Originally Posted by Ice

With loans of any kind it is better to attack the fraud... not have them verify the debt.



Remember, you funded the loan. But that isn't what you agreed to do. Look at the copy of your loan agreement. Does it say anywhere in there that you agree to fund the loan?



Think about it.



Did the bank give consideration in accordance to the alleged agreement? Did the written agreement say "loan" or "exchange"? Did the bank loan legal tender? Did the bank loan a check backed by cash as consideration loaned to legally obtain your note? Did the bank change the cost and risk of the written agreement? What was the valuable consideration loaned if the bank received the note for free?



Do you have a Black's? check the definitions... even the simple ones for stuff like "bank", loan, exchange, liability, debt, check, interest, agreement, etc. Then check equal protection, fraudulent conversion, forgery, false pretense, theft, false representation, counterfeit, failure of consideration, material fact, moneychanger, larceny by deception... and etc. I'm sure some of the other members could think of a few more.



A letter asking for clarification of what the agreement was and what it actually became may have been better than a verification request. You might have even started with a simple request to view the original agreement / PN. (You do this to see if they still possess it or to see if it has been altered (at which time you can ask what the alterations mean).



Ice

Yeah I totally agree with Ice on this one and to piggy back on what he said, I usually combine the VOD and fraud issue into one letter. In other words, I request Certified Verification under the FDCPA and define *Certified Verification* for them. That definition tells them to produce the original prom note, provide full disclosure as to the source of the alleged loan check, makes them explain the costs and risks of the alleged loan, etc. Either way, if they can't verify the debt, then they must cease all collection activity under the FDCPA - otherwise they can be held liable for your actual and pecuniary (money) damages associated with their debt collection practices.



Also, make sure you do your legal research and cite cases, statutes, etc. to prove your point. Never make blanket statements without providing some law to back you up. And go a step further and explain the law to them just in case they try to play dumb (LOL).



I also want to challenge the lienholder of my car but, honestly, I'm scared. Yes I know they can't verify the debt but at the same time, they WILL try to repossess my car anyway! Possession is 9/10th of the law - ya know?!



I'm just curious to figure out a way to demand verification on a secured loan (whether it is a car loan, mortgage, etc.) and protect the property at the same time. Any thoughts????

Originally Posted by PJT04

I'M GLAD SOMEONE MENTIONED THIS TOPIC.



I'VE DONE SOMETHING SIMILAR TO THIS WHERE I ASKED THE ALLEGED AUTO LENDER TO SHOW ME THE ORIGINAL CONTRACT OR VERIFY THE DEBT. THEY TOTALLY IGNORED MYCERTIFIED LETTERS AND KEPT SENDING BILLS UNTIL THEY CHARGED-OFF THE DEBT AND PASSED THE ACCOUNT ON TO A SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR.



I'M DEALING WITH THIS NEW CHARACTER NOW. AGAIN,I'VE ASKED TO SEE THE ORIGINAL CONTRACT/VALIDATION OF DEBT/PROOF IT'S ME/ETC..AND NO RESPONSE.



A FEW DAYS AGO,THE SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR SENT ME AN ID THEFT AFFIDAVIT SHE WANTS ME TO SIGN. OF COURSE I WILL SIGN THIS AFFIDAVIT RIGHT AROUND NEVER <font color=red>[/color].



I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON THEIR SIDE BUT I PRESUME THEY THINK SOMEONE COMMITED IDENTITY FRAUD. I HAD MENTIONED IN ONE OF MY LETTERS THAT THE CONTRACT COULD BE FRAUDULENT AND THAT I NEEDED TO SEE THE SIGNATURE ON THE ORIGINAL DOCUMENT. MAYBE THEY'RE TRYING TO TWIST THINGS AROUND AND MAKE IT LOOK LIKE SOMEONE STOLE MY IDENTITY.



ONE LAST THING. THE AFFIDAVIT FROM THE SPECIAL INVESTIGATOR HAS A NOTE AT THE BOTTOM OF EACH PAGE THAT READS:



DO NOT SEND AFFIDAVIT TO THE FTC OR ANY OTHER GOVERNMENT AGENCY.



PRETTY FISHY HUH? WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK?

Aw hell naw!!!!!!!!!!!! Honey this is some bullshyt!!! They KNOW they are shady as hell, which is why they told you not to file a claim against them at the FTC.



If you haven't done this already, I would suggest that you do the following:



Write TU, Equifax,and Experian and demand verification for this account and attach this letter to your correspondence. I'll bet ya this account will be removed from your credit reports in 30 days flat!



Next, read 15 USC 1692 (the FDCPA) and learn it cold. Then write another VOD letter to this slimy creditor demanding them to verify the debt or cease all collection activities or else face legal liability from you for your actual and money damages associated with their debt collection practices (all of this can be found in the FDCPA). Send a copy of this letter (and their letter to you) to the FTC, State and Federal Attorney General''s Office, State Banking Department, and any other State or Federal Agency that has jurisdiction over these slimballs. . . . .

[gregtu]

Check to see if the lien on your cars are complete and correct - bet they're not. Also, check to see if the judge signed the lien!!! Bet he didn't!!! Have the judge remove the lien, because it is/was not filed properly.



Make sure to get a copy of the lien and study it:-)