Citizenship & Jurisdiction Discuss your citizenship status, how to change it, and how this effects particular organization's jurisdiction over you.


Go Back   Suijuris Forums > Educational & Learning > Citizenship & Jurisdiction
User Name
Password

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 05-22-2005, 09:23 AM
palani's Avatar
palani palani is offline
Come and Get Some!
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,038
Can this be considered evidence of fictional state?

Just checked my state constitution and found the following under Right of Suffrage - Electors:

Every [white] [male] citizen of the United States of the age of 21 years , ... some residency stuff ... , shall be entitled to vote at all elections....

The terms [white] and [male] have been eliminated by amendments. The above paragraph was enacted in 1857 when the entire constitution was re-written. I haven't been able to find a copy of the original constitution that had been in affect for over 10 years prior to 1857.

My question is - if citizenship is a concept of municipal law and the concept of a United States citizen only came into being in 1868 with the 14th amendment then who was entitled to vote in elections in my state for 11 years between 1857 and 1868. Had United States citizens somehow existed in this state for years before the federal government discovered the concept? Does this possibly give certain rights to how the term 'United States citizen' is defined and used to the state since the state use of the term preceeded the federal use?

If there were no 'qualified' citizen electors from the beginning then when did they start existing? Even more to the point, do they exist now? Also, if they had constitutional rights in 1857 reserved from the federal government then why do these rights not exist now for someone who makes the same claim to the same citizenship?

Another point is that these historical fictional electors could only vote (and still may only vote?) if they are of 21 years of age AND NO OTHER AGE. My OPINION is that the original drafters of this paragraph intended to say 21 years OR OLDER but that is not the wording . Wonder if the Secretary of State might not be improperly certifying the elections of state officials. So, who exists today in an official capacity if improperly elected?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-23-2005, 02:31 PM
Heli Heli is offline
Waking Up
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 5
Another Ohioian I see. Welcome!!!

I've pondered the same question a number of times. I'll find a link to the origional 1803 Constitution for you and post it.

Regards,
Heli
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-23-2005, 03:48 PM
palani's Avatar
palani palani is offline
Come and Get Some!
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,038
Heli

Sorry .. Wrong state .. You might have noticed I intentionally left the state information out. I was interested in what other states might have similar circumstances. Also, the question might be more interesting if people wonder "is this my state?"

I thought Ohio became a state sometime in the 1950's (ex post facto law retroactive to the 1800's?)

palani
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Allodial TiTle and Land Patents, Ownerships Highest proof^i^ Birdman^i^ Land Ownership 34 10-22-2008 04:50 AM
Contractor's licenses?? Rory Success Stories 243 01-15-2008 06:56 AM
declaratory judgment win!!! kgod999 Success Stories 44 12-13-2005 08:54 AM
State license to practice law jaylon Court 0 09-08-2005 05:02 PM
Gun Control Cites & Code suijuris Court 15 02-26-2005 04:13 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:17 AM.
Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 2.4.0
2003-2008 Copyright by Law Research Group, LLC Terms of Use | Sitemap | Privacy Policy | Notice/Disclaimer