Court Discuss the tactics used by the court system, and how to develop your counter-tactics for success in the courtroom, dealing with citations, criminal and civil matters.


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  #1  
Old 11-16-2004, 08:26 AM
KITCHIE KITCHIE is offline
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Exclamation Heeellllppp!!!

Hi Everybody,

The Animal control Officer forgot to sign the citation. She called me today and wants to either come to my house or have me meet her somewhere so she can sign my copy.

I feel like the legal document has been delivered and any thing new added after three days would be a brand new contract or, an alteration of the original.

Ideas, suggestions, thoughts are really appreciated.

Kitchie
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  #2  
Old 11-16-2004, 11:44 AM
HenryBowman
 
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If you are really really stupid (and I say this with tongue in cheek, cause I don't know you and this isn't personal) by all means let her sign it.

If you are as bright as I believe you must be to be here at this board,

I'd secure that citation in a safe location so that it never sees the light of day until you are supposed to show up.

This is your evidence that they don't have a valid claim.

Think about it.

Oh yeah, Save the Answering machine message onto a tape. Document her knowledge of her mistake, and that may come in handy too. I wouldn't pull ti out unless absolutely necessary, but evidence is evidence. She knows you have no citation without her signature. Let her worry about that.



HB

Last edited by HenryBowman : 11-16-2004 at 11:46 AM.
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  #3  
Old 11-16-2004, 01:15 PM
squirrels
 
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What if you lost or misplaced it? Would you be under a duty to draw up another one as well? Are they going to pay you for your time to meet them so they can sign it? Maybe you would like to modify the contract and then have them sign it with terms in your favor? Add a few conditions maybe? Limit its jurisdiction? You can have fun with this if you'd like to.

-squirrels
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  #4  
Old 11-16-2004, 03:40 PM
KITCHIE KITCHIE is offline
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HeyThere HenryBowman!!

Thanks for the advice and thanks for getting back to me too.

That's what I thought no valid ticket. Now she is going to have to come to court too to explain why she didn't sign it. Also one of her co-workers said without the signature of the officer the Judge will likely through it out.

As a side comment; The guys dog was out all night so a mountain lion or a bobcat or even the coyotes probably got it. The coyotes have been around in some of the biggest groups I have ever seen since I moved here 16 years ago. There are no witnesses to this event.

You love this...I asked the AC officer what condition the dog was in when they found it. And she replied "It was dead." I said DUHHHH what conditition was the body in? She said his throat was ripped open.

I have plenty of neighbors who are writing affidavits so that I can take these to court.

And I REALLY feel bad for the guy who lost his dog. But when you live where wild animals are, I don't think it's good form to only have ONE dog to fend for himself. I have six dogs all herd dogs.

Kitchie
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  #5  
Old 11-16-2004, 06:31 PM
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Camino Camino is offline
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Heeellllppp!!!

Hello Kitchie.

Remember that the citation is an offer to contract. They want to sign it as all contracts must have (1) An Offer, (2) A Consideration, (3) Acceptance by all parties, (4) Signatures of all parties to the contract.

Only the signed parties to a contract can discuss the contract. Remember that the court is for disputes only. Tell the encroachment officer you threw it out. If she writes you a new one I would return the citation to the sender as offer refused for lack of subject matter jurisdiction (the name on the citation isn't you... it's your corporate fiction ALL CAPS NAME) they can't come at you, the flesh and blood man or woman they can only come after the ALL CAPS NAME. When in doubt punt it back to them. Hope this helps.

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Last edited by Camino : 11-16-2004 at 06:36 PM.
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  #6  
Old 11-18-2004, 10:52 AM
KITCHIE KITCHIE is offline
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Hey There Everybody!!

After I got home from court in Reno Animal Control showed up.

She said: Hi how ya doing? I am here to sing the citation and I
need your part of the it so I can sign it.

I said: I can't let you do that.

She said: Oh I have to.

I said: I have rights and I refused it for fraud and sent it back to the court.

She said "You did not!"

I said: I sent it certified mail would you like to see a copy of the letter?

She said: "Allllllright" and got red in the face and tried to take off out of
here really fast and couldn't, because my dogs were in front of her tires.

So that's how my day went this morning. My friend wrote this back to me after I told him:

"Does the actions by the AC officer convince you that she screwed the pooch on this one? You handled her well because now you can call her as a hostile witness about your having sent the notice to the court via certified mail and she will have to testify as to why she was out at your property without permission or request."

And how was your day???

Kitchie
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  #7  
Old 11-18-2004, 12:13 PM
HenryBowman
 
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He heh heh

Good job!


HB
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  #8  
Old 12-01-2004, 06:55 PM
KITCHIE KITCHIE is offline
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Hi Everyone,

Well today was Arraignment day for Animal control. I filed a motition to dismiss prior to court begining and I had a copy for the judge and a copy for the State attorney.

Below is my Motion.

Katherine-Elizabeth; Snedigar,
Creditor- Secured Party
c/o 4400 Pasture View Rd.
Reno [89510] Nevada State
775-475-0300




SPARKS JUSTICE COURT

SPARKS, NEVADA


The State of Nevada, ] Citation #4686
]
Washoe County ]
Plaintiff, ]
]
vs. ]
] MOTION TO DISMISS FOR LACK
Katherine-Elizabeth; Snedigar, ] OF JURISDICTION
Creditor- Secured Party ]
]
Defendant ]

MOTION TO DISMISS FOR LACK OF DUE PROCESS
I, Katherine-Elizabeth; Snedigar, Creditor-Secured Party, neither gives nor grants any form of jurisdiction or venue to this court. I am making a special restricted appearance in Propria Persona and I am not making a general appearance. I am reserving all of my rights, remedies and defenses, statutory or procedural, at all times. I waive none of my rights, remedies and defenses, statutory or procedural, at any time for any reason. I am in constant fear of my life, liberty and property from police, troopers, State of Nevada and Washoe County, a municipal corporation and judges.
Based on the below stated facts I move for motion to dismiss:
/////
This court does not have subject matter jurisdiction because the citation was not properly issued and NRS 171.1773 was violated.
NRS 171.1773 Form and contents of citation: When person detained by peace officer.
1. Whenever a person is detained by a peace officer for any violation of a county, city or town ordinance or a state law which is punishable as a misdemeanor and he is not taken before a magistrate as required or permitted by NRS 171.177, 171.1771 or 171.1772, the peace officer may prepare a misdemeanor citation manually or electronically in the form of a complaint issuing in the name of “The State of Nevada” or in the name of the respective county, city or town, containing a notice to appear in court, the name and address of the person, the state registration number of his vehicle, if any, the offense charged, including a brief description of the offense and the NRS or ordinance citation, the time when and place where the person is required to appear in court, and such other pertinent information as may be necessary. The citation must be signed by the peace officer. If the citation is prepared electronically, the officer shall sign the copy of the citation that is delivered to the person charged with the violation.

1. There is jurisdictional failing on the face of the record, i.e. the citation identified as #4686, the matter is void and any ruling by this court without jurisdiction is void. Void judgment is one where court lacked personal or subject matter jurisdiction or entry of order violated due process, U.S.C.A. Const. Amend. 5 – Triad Energy Corp. v. McNell 110 F.R.D. 382 (S.D.N.Y. 1986). Judgment is a void judgment if court that rendered judgment lacked jurisdiction of the subject matter, or of the parties, or acted in a manner inconsistent with due process, Fed. Rules Civ. Proc., Rule 60(b)(4), 28 U.S.C.A.; U.S.C.A. Const. Amend. 5 – Klugh v. U.S., 620 F.Supp. 892 (D.S.C. 1985). A void judgment is one which, from its inception, was, was a complete nullity and without legal effect, Rubin v. Johns, 109 F.R.D. 174 (D. Virgin Islands 1985). A judgment shown by evidence to be invalid for want of jurisdiction is a void judgment or at all events has all attributes of a void judgment, City of Los Angeles v. Morgan, 234 P.2d 319 (Cal.App. 2 Dist. 1951). Void judgment which is subject to collateral attack, is simulated judgment devoid of any potency because of jurisdictional defects, Ward v. Terriere, 386 P.2d 352 (Colo. 1963).
2. The improperly identified dogs were not in the presence of any, as yet, identified Animal Control Officer when the alleged act was act committed.
3. The improperly identified dogs were not in the presence of the owner of the dog that was killed when the act was act committed.
4. The unidentified Animal Control Officer submitted an inadequate and fraudulent declaration/citation that was not sworn to and was not verified by the officer’s signature on said declaration, under penalty of perjury as defined by NRS 171.1773 supra.
5. The unidentified Animal Control Officer who issued the citation to “defendant” on the mere statement(s) by a party(ies) that [a] Defendant’s dogs committed a killing of another dog, which is [are] vague, and improperly identified “defendant’s dogs, in a vague statement that they looked like “defendant’s” dogs.
6. There is no sworn affidavit by complainant.
7. There is no sworn affidavit by citing officer, for a misdemeanor not committed in her presence,
8. The citation #4686 is not signed by the issuing Animal Control Officer.

Without prejudice
____________________________
By: Katherine-Elizabeth; Snedigar, Creditor Secured Party, Authorized Representative

ACKNOWLEDGEMENT
County of Washoe )
) ss
State of Nevada )

I Certify that the afore Affiant, Katherine-Elizabeth; Snedigar, personally appeared and personally known to me, ______________________a Notary, Subscribed and sworn and under Oath on the ________day of____________ __, 2004.
WITNESS my hand and official seal.

_____________________________ SEAL
NOTARY PUBLIC

_____________________________
My Commission Expires:


The result was that when the state attorney argued it she said it was that they did have a signed citation by Officer Lani Badge #11 and that it was conflicting because it said there was no subject matter Jurisdictin and the is said void for lack of due process... you get it.

I just sat there there and when it was my turn I said well I have my copy of the citation right here and it is not signed. And the AC officer came to my house 4 days after she issued the citation and asked that I give her my copy so she could sign it.

Here the answer for that. "The complaint can be ammended."

OK now I say yes they could ammend the complaint if the address was wrong, or if the name was spelled wrong but when a statute says you MUST and they don't then it is a voidable process!!!!!

So am I nuts on that?

Kitchie
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  #9  
Old 12-01-2004, 07:04 PM
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KaosTheory KaosTheory is offline
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I'm still sketchy on what actually happened. Are they saying that the citation is still valid and that you are going to trial now?
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Last edited by KaosTheory : 12-01-2004 at 11:37 PM.
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  #10  
Old 12-01-2004, 07:11 PM
HenryBowman
 
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You should have used Marc Steven's Stuff.

You could have hammered them.

What did they do to you?

HB
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