Chapter 13 to discharge mortgage debt

[iamfreeru2]

Hello all,

I have spoken with a gentleman this evening that is going to provide proof that using the BK court under chapter 13 you can have the alleged mortgage debt discharged. I am skeptical at best, but I will be checking this out and if true, this is going to help lots of people. As I get more info I will pass it along. If it is what this guy says it is my wife and I will be using it. If it works I will share with all. Stay tuned.

[sfergnel]

I found the following information on a freedom website, and thought it was interesting. And it is precisely why I have never, even though I probably should have, declared bankruptcy.

"Bankrupt [L bank a bench + ruptus broken, literally one whose bench has been broken, the bench or table which a merchant or banker formerly used in the exchange having been broken on his bankruptcy.]

The Consolidated WEBSTER’S Encyclopedic Dictionary 1939 edition.

Bankrupt. Originally and strictly, a trader who secretes himself or does certain other acts tending to defraud his creditors. In a looser sense, an insolvent person. In English law there were two characteristics which distinguished bankrupts from insolvents; the former must have been a trader and the object of the proceedings against, not by him. As used in American law, the distinction between a bankrupt and an insolvent is not generally regarded.

Do you find it interesting that a “bankrupt” is one who acts to “defraud his creditors?” Who fits the description of a trader and who is the creditor?

Trader. One who makes it his business to buy merchandise, goods, or chattels to sell the same at a profit. One who sells goods substantially in the form in which they are bought; one who has not converted them into another form of property by his skill and labor.

The above definitions for “bankrupt” or “trader” could not be found in the Black’s 6th edition and here is probably why. What institution do you know of “sells chattels substantially in the form in which they are bought?” Here is a hint – what does the bank do when they deposit your promissory note as an asset instead of a liability, then writes a check off of the deposit to give to the seller of the property? First of all, the bankers do not “buy” your credit with “money.” After you GIVE your credit to them, they sell your credit to the seller of the property without “converting it into another form.” It goes in and comes out the same – your credit! Or as they would say “money.” Could this be considered of the bank to be an “act to defraud his creditor?”

Bankrupt Law. The leading distinction between a bankrupt law and an insolvent law, in the proper technical sense, consists in the character of the persons upon whom it is designed to operate, - the former contemplating as its objects bankrupts only, that is traders of a certain description; the latter insolvents in general, or persons unable to pay their debts. This has led to a marked separation between the two systems, in principle and in practice, which in England has always been carefully maintained, although the United States it has of late been disregarded. The only substantial difference between a strictly bankrupt law and an insolvent law lies in the cir***stance that the former affords relief upon the application of the creditor, and the latter upon the application of the debtor.

Why do you think that United States has failed to maintain the difference between bankrupt and insolvency? I have a theory. Since they call you “bankrupt,” they are “assuming” that you are acting to defraud your creditors and therefore you are in dishonor before walking into the court room, and that you are considered a “criminal” by the mere fact the you filed your bankruptcy petition."

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I have friends who are in the process now, and unless you agree to, and make, payments on time, foreclosure is still an option because it is a SECURED obligation.

[iamfreeru2]

Sfergnel,

I do not know enough yet, but what I have been told is that it involves an affidavit to validate the debt, UCC-1 and Bond. When I have all the pieces together I will let all know. I should be getting info today.

The BK court is the only place to take this, because the US is bankrupt and they are defrauding us. As The flesh and blood man or woman you are the creditor and you are using your exemption under HJR 192. When you use the BK court it is because they are bankrupt and that is why you use your UCC-1 to show you are the Creditor. They are bankrupt and you are asking them to validate the debt. This cannot be done and people are getting these alleged debts discharged. This is makes sense and I can understand why we have not gotten remedy because we have been going about it all wrong. At least this is what has been said to me.

Do not take what I have said as gospel. I will let all know what I find out. I think my understanding is correct, but will not know for sure till I get all the pieces.

[iamfreeru2]

Another thing I have been told is that you never stop making your payments until the alleged debt has been discharged. This is another confirmation why those that stopped paying that are in DG process have had problems. What I was also told is that my wife and I should have gone into the BK court in the beginning and tendered our BoE there. That would have given us the settlement and closure we were looking for. Whether this is true or not remains to be seen.

iamfree2, go to www.theawaregroup.com, download a copy of "Lawyers Secret Oath", check out page 13, it's 16 pages long. This tells about a Mr. Sweet, who filed a common law lien on his own property, making himself and his wife debtor and creditor, by filling out a financing statement using a UCC-1 form, which alters the legal situation, this is handled from the Secretary of State's office, depending on your state, it may only be done in one or maybe two offices in the state, you will have to find out. I don't know if this will help you at this point in the game but it's one of the best strategys of protection I've ever seen.

[iamfreeru2]

Quote from lavender:
"This tells about a Mr. Sweet, who filed a common law lien on his own property, making himself and his wife debtor and creditor, by filling out a financing statement using a UCC-1 form, which alters the legal situation, this is handled from the Secretary of State's office, depending on your state, it may only be done in one or maybe two offices in the state, you will have to find out."

Been there and done that. Did not stop the court from rendering a summary judgment against the Strawman. Using the BK court my be just what we are looking for.

Thanks for the information though.

Iamfreeru2

[Livefire]

When the judge instructs a jury, he/she will generally say the applicable law concerning a case is whatever comes out of his/her mouth. I think they do what they want irregardless of what the letter of the law actually is! Thats why we see no consistent results. Some judges follow law more closely than others. At least one can force a creditor to validate a debt at a BK hearing! I also wonder if this would also work in the US Court of Claims since we are claiming alien status with respect to USA Inc?? Best of luck in this endeavor imfreeru2!

[squirrel]

Please forgive my ignorance but what does BK stand for ?

[iamfreeru2]

Bankruptcy Court

[iamfreeru2]

Livefire,

Quote from Livefire:
"When the judge instructs a jury, he/she will generally say the applicable law concerning a case is whatever comes out of his/her mouth. I think they do what they want irregardless of what the letter of the law actually is! Thats why we see no consistent results. Some judges follow law more closely than others. At least one can force a creditor to validate a debt at a BK hearing! I also wonder if this would also work in the US Court of Claims since we are claiming alien status with respect to USA Inc?? Best of luck in this endeavor imfreeru2!"

I do not have the info regarding using the BK court yet. I spoke with the guy that has all the info this evening and he will also be sending me a copy of a check that is in the millions. He told me that Paul O'Neil was fired as SOT because he was allowing BoEs to be paid through the Treasury. Of course the government is painting a totally different picture. The info I am waiting on should be very interesting. Hopefully I will have it soon. Paul O'Neil allowing the BoEs to be paid explains the one tendered in Waco Texas to release Jerry Ronald Williamson from prison, as he was the SOT at the time.

I cannot wait to get this info and am looking forward to it. Whether it will be useful in the court of claims I do not know. We shall see.

iamfreeru2