Twenty-five U.S. Military Officers Challenge Official Account of 9/11

[Shoonra]

Originally Posted by mrg

"half-demolished?"

Show me 50% demolition of both buildings.

The Verizon Bldg and the Deutsche Bank had to be closed for about a year while most of the interiors and a good deal of the exterior was being repaired. There are plenty of photos of the damage on the internet.

[rottweiler]

Cossiga knows all about the secret societies and the intel agencies. He is the one who revealed the existence of Operation Gladio. He ought to know, he helped administer it. When a rival of his threatened to blow the whistle he confessed and resigned.

Originally Posted by Shoonra

Cossiga was President of Italy from 1985 thru 1992, resigning in the face of possible impeachment.

I cannot imagine he was privy to any high level intelligence data about Sept 11th.

[mrg]

How, precisely do YOU, yourself "show me" "50% demolition ["half-demolished"] of both buildings?"

...most of the interiors...being repaired...

Prove YOUR claim.

SHOW me YOUR proof.




Slither, squirm, twist and turn.



Pathological?

Stock-in-trade?

Both?

[rottweiler]

That's funny. Deutsche Bank was being slowly dismantled due to asbestos before the 9/11 attacks.

The thing is WTC needed to be demolished also but it could not be done because of the asbestos fireproofing. It was estimated to cost 30 billion to dismantle the WTC piece by piece like they were doing to Deutsche Bank b4 9/11.

I see Silverstein is suing for another 12 billion. Considering he invested less than 200 million a couple months b4 9/11 and collected 4 billion already, he has done incredibly well for himself. He could potentially earn 100 times his original investment and I will not be suprised if he never pays a dime of it in taxes. Cossiga doesn't need high level intelligence connections to smell that rat nosed ashkenazi from across the ocean.

Originally Posted by Shoonra

The Verizon Bldg and the Deutsche Bank had to be closed for about a year while most of the interiors and a good deal of the exterior was being repaired. There are plenty of photos of the damage on the internet.

[Shoonra]

Originally Posted by rottweiler

I see Silverstein is suing for another 12 billion. Considering he invested less than 200 million a couple months b4 9/11 and collected 4 billion already, he has done incredibly well for himself. He could potentially earn 100 times his original investment and I will not be suprised if he never pays a dime of it in taxes. Cossiga doesn't need high level intelligence connections to smell that rat nosed ashkenazi from across the ocean.

Larry Silverstein is the head of a consortium of investors who leased the WTC complex from the NY-NJ Port Authority, a deal which was finalized only about 6 weeks before the attack (it looked like the lease was going to go to another group, but at the last minute they couldn't raise the money -- by that time the hijackers were already in the US and preparing their hijackings). The lease obtained by the Silverstein consortium requires it to pay the Port Authority some enormous annual payment ostensibly from rents received, and to return the WTC to the Port Authority at the end of the lease. So the consortium is hardly making money, it has serious challenges living up to its end of the deal; and even if the consortium wasn't obligated to the Port Authority the money wouldn't go into Silverstein's pocket - revenues from the WTC are supposed to be distributed among hundreds of investors. On top of that, the very complicated insurance policy on the WTC complex, so enormous that it had to be divided up among several large European insurers, was so badly written that the consortium had to go through prolonged litigation to make sure that insureres paid off on both towers instead of only one.

Larry Silverstein is, himself, one the most important real estate investors in the NYC area and a prosperous lawyer. While those professions have not been associated with sainthood, I had not heard of him being accused of so much as under-tipping in a restaurant or having an overdue library book. If he decided to commit a crime he certainly started at the very top ( for one thing, he might have done it on a night or weekend when there'd be fewer lives lost). He doesn't need to destroy the WTC and the suggestion that he not only wanted this but that he planned and was able to execute this elaborate business with hijacking and the like to kill thousands of people to obtain money is the work of truly disturbed minds. Oddly enough, when pressed for any evidence that Silverstein would go to such lengths and kill so many people when there are easier ways to make money, most conspiracy theorists can point to no other evidence than that he's Jewish (and that they envy his prosperity).

[BOBT12]

Originally Posted by Shoonra

Larry Silverstein is the head of a consortium of investors who leased the WTC complex from the NY-NJ Port Authority, a deal which was finalized only about 6 weeks before the attack (it looked like the lease was going to go to another group, but at the last minute they couldn't raise the money -- by that time the hijackers were already in the US and preparing their hijackings). The lease obtained by the Silverstein consortium requires it to pay the Port Authority some enormous annual payment ostensibly from rents received, and to return the WTC to the Port Authority at the end of the lease. So the consortium is hardly making money, it has serious challenges living up to its end of the deal; and even if the consortium wasn't obligated to the Port Authority the money wouldn't go into Silverstein's pocket - revenues from the WTC are supposed to be distributed among hundreds of investors. On top of that, the very complicated insurance policy on the WTC complex, so enormous that it had to be divided up among several large European insurers, was so badly written that the consortium had to go through prolonged litigation to make sure that insureres paid off on both towers instead of only one.

Larry Silverstein is, himself, one the most important real estate investors in the NYC area and a prosperous lawyer. While those professions have not been associated with sainthood, I had not heard of him being accused of so much as under-tipping in a restaurant or having an overdue library book. If he decided to commit a crime he certainly started at the very top ( for one thing, he might have done it on a night or weekend when there'd be fewer lives lost). He doesn't need to destroy the WTC and the suggestion that he not only wanted this but that he planned and was able to execute this elaborate business with hijacking and the like to kill thousands of people to obtain money is the work of truly disturbed minds. Oddly enough, when pressed for any evidence that Silverstein would go to such lengths and kill so many people when there are easier ways to make money, most conspiracy theorists can point to no other evidence than that he's Jewish (and that they envy his prosperity).

Most people point to Silverstein's "Pull it" comments as a reason for suspicion.

[rottweiler]

By Jerry Mazza
Online Journal Associate Editor

Apr 3, 2008, 00:38

Like the proverbial bad penny, Lucky Larry Silverstein keeps popping up. He’s back and he’s bad again. Not content with the nearly $4.6 billion in insurance payments he received to cover his losses at the World Trade Center, he is now seeking $12.3 billion in damages from the airlines and airport security companies for the 9/11 attack in a suit filed in 2004.

Not tainted enough by the fact that Silverstein & Partners took out a lease for 99 years in July of 2001 on the WTC, two months before the attack . . . not content Larry & Partners upped the insurance at that time to $3.5 billion and (presciently) to cover potential hits by airliners flown by “terrorist hijackers” . . .

Not content that Silverstein & Partners subsequently sued the insurers for $7 billion, considering the attack a double strike because separate liners hit Towers One and Two. Not content that Larry spent the next six years in litigation with the insurance companies, only to have the deal fortunately settled, brokered by then Governor Spitzer in 2007, yielding $4.55 to Lucky Larry and Partners . . .

Not content either that his personal stake in the lease was only some $14 million, the balance supplied by his partners. Not content that he made another $500 million on the destruction of his Tower 7, which he owned and quickly rebuilt bigger and better. Not content that no liner hit Tower 7 and that the fires were out, he announced at 3:30 p.m. on 9/11 that there had been so much pain and suffering that he and the NYFD decided to “pull it” -- Tower 7 . . .

Not content that in fact at 5 p,m,, not even two hours later . . . Tower 7 went down at the freefall speed of gravity in a matter of seconds neatly into its own footprint, a classic “internal demolition.” Not content that you can’t set up an internal demolition on a 47-story steel-framed building in less than two hours or two days, or even two weeks. Not content that his “smoking gun” has attracted the attention of every 9/11 critic around the world . . .

Not content that the BBC made an incredible gaffe as a TV journo of theirs, supposedly in New York, reported that Tower 7 had fallen, that is, 26 minutes before it actually fell and with a News24 “time stamp” video to prove it. Not content that even Google had to pull the video . . . Larry Silverstein, the Oliver Twist of 9/11 disaster, is back, asking for more, sir, more please. Incredible! What colossal chutzpah!

But hey, Larry’s got reasons; boy, does he have reasons. His lawyers aired them in the United States Southeastern District Court in Manhattan, the same court in which the 9/11 victims families have been plaintiffs for cases to sue the airlines and security companies, and by the way, where 90 families have been turned down for lawsuits and only two remain who haven’t taken the money and shut up, and where Ellen Mariani has been consistently turned down and continues to be . . .

Yet,Larry’s lawyers have come to ask the wonderful Judge Hellerstein for more, the same Hellerstein who asked all the families to take the money and “move on” and told them that “money was the universal lubricant . . ." What goes around comes around.

By the way, the total claims involved come to about $23 billion. Silverstein’s chunk could endanger claims from other businesses and property owners, defense lawyers say. Why, Donald Migliori himself, the lawyer for the victims’ families, said he was confident “that their claims would not be affected because they would take priority over the property claims,” as reported by the New York Times. So they won’t be taking food from widows’ and children’s mouths to feed Larry, not this week at least.

Nevertheless, Desmond Barry, a lawyer for the airlines, said that if Lucky Larry won his claims, “He could push the total claims beyond the amount of insurance that the airlines and security companies have available. 'There ain’t that much insurance,' Mr. Barry said."

Silverstein’s laundry list for the $12.3 billion goes like this, “$8.4 billion for the replacement of destroyed buildings and $3.9 billion in ‘other costs,’ including $100 million a year in rent to the Port authority and $300 million a year in lost rental income, as well as the cost of marketing and leasing the new buildings.”

Mr. Barry, the Times tells us, reminded Silverstein’s folks that he “had been more than compensated by the nearly $4.6 billion insurance settlement, reached after almost six years of litigation. He argued that Mr. S. was entitled to the market value of the property, which he said had been established by the $3.2 billion.”

Judge Hellerstein was skeptical about Mr. Silverstein’s claim, and asked why he hadn’t sucked up his losses by just “walking away.” Hellerstein asked, “What’s the nature of your recovery,” to which Larry’s lawyer, Mr. Williamson, answered, “For damages suffered by the events of 9/11, not value. Damages.” He claimed the lease required Silverstein to rebuild and keep on paying rent.

Hellerstein retorted, “And so I’m putting to you if you walked away from the lease, you would lose the value of the lease . . . Would you have a further obligation to pay money?” Williamson answered, “You have to examine that question . . . But to me that’s not the test of what are our damages.”

When Hellerstein pressed for a dollar figure on damages, not the “precise amount,” i.e., “some order of magnitude would be appropriate,” Williamson balked. Barry said, “I think their claim is $12.3 billion.” Williamson added, “Plus prejudgment interest,” To which Hellerstein “tartly replied, 'We shouldn’t forget that.'” They won’t let you, Alvin.

Plaintiffs’ lawyers added that even after many settlements, there are seven wrongful death and two injury cases remaining from the more than 90 filed. Migliori, the victims’ survivors’ lawyer, felt that the claims with property damage, including Lucky Larry and some insurance company looking to recoup payments, should allow the death and injury cases priority of payment of damages. Fair enough.

Judge Hellerstein passed on setting a trial date. He said that would be “fictitious,” yet set a deadline for fact-finding for Silverstein to offer more documentation of his claim -- or risk losing it. Any trials, by the way, seem to be more than a year away.

The real caveat here is that to win a case of that size for damages, Silverstein would have to go to court for discovery. Meaning his lawyers could bring in every fireman who heard a blast, Silverstein himself for his “pull” remark, and even Hizzoner Rudy Giuliani for saying that morning, at 9:15 to ABC’s Peter Jennings, on the street that someone told him the towers were coming down. In short, you could grill ass like the devil until you found out what really happened.

Bottom line, Larry could get a billion dollar bone thrown at him, a take-the-money and-shut-up bone. Or Larry could end up in cement shoes, for real or legally. After all, Larry knew, going into the lease purchase that the Towers were asbestos-laden bombs, the first 60 floors sprayed with the building material when built from 1968 to '72. And they were supposed to be taken down eventually, according to a 1971 New York Council ban on asbestos.

Obviously, the buildings couldn’t be legally taken down by explosion or implosion. They would have to be taken down piece by piece. The cost would be in the billions by today’s standards. But there was another way to take them down, wasn’t there?

[Shoonra]

Originally Posted by rottweiler

The editor of the Popular Mechanics article, Ben Chertoff is the cousin of the fake Jew Director of Homeland Security.

I have no reason to suppose tht Michael Chertoff is a "fake Jew"; hard to imagine someone opting to be a Jew when he might otherwise join VP Cheney's country club. Michael Chertoff's father was the rabbi of B'nai Israel Synagogue in Elizabeth, NJ, and his mother was a stewardess on ElAl Israeli airlines. Seems plenty real Jews to me.

Michael Chertoff had been US Attorney for NY, and in 2001 was the head of the US Dept of Justice Criminal Division. In 2003 he became a judge in the US Third Circuit Court of Appeals. Two years later he resigned his judgeship to become Secretary of Homeland Security.

So Chertoff wasn't in any position to participate or even observe the attacks of Sept 11th. He came to his position fully four and a half years after the attacks.

So being Chertoff's cousin isn't much of a disgrace. In fact most people raised outside trailer parks would be rather proud to have a federal attorney and judge in the family.

On the other hand, you've been very coy about your family. I can understand that there might be reciprocal shame in that relationship but I have suspected that some of your cousins might be serving more than one purpose on your family tree. In the absence of reliable evidence perhaps we should assume that you descend from some old American family .... like the Jukes.

[Shoonra]

Silverstein is trying to get reimbursement for his consortium's very onerous responsibilities to (1) have a WTC complex with buildings to hand back to the Port Authority when the lease is up, and (2) make up to all his investors for lost revenues. Long story short, even if he wins all these lawsuits, he will not have appreciably more for himself than if the WTC were still standing and renting out office space.

If you insist on supposing that he had something to do with the planning of the Sept 11 attacks, then you ought to estimate how much that attack would have cost him. I'm sure that four jetliners and three hundred FDNY firemen don't go cheaply. Deduct the expense of arranging the Sept 11th attacks from his "windfall" and it doesn't look quite so profitable.

And, believe it or not, there are easier ways for Larry Silverstein to have made money than to initiate World War Three.

[rottweiler]

Those credentials are like lipstick on a pig. Real Jews obey the Torah and not the satanic version. Anyone who would work for Homeland Security GESTAPO is either ignorant or evil and Chertoff is not ignorant. Whatever you get out of it is not worth it. You are just $hitting the bed.

I see consistency with the ashkenazi's. Chertoff was the scum who allowed the suspected Israeli terrorists and spies to quietly return to Israel after 9/11. Then the US government hires the likes of the former head of the KGB, General Primakov and the former head of the East German Stasi Marcus Wolf for Homeland Security.

If you really gave a damn about jews you would be concerned that these nazi's are gaining such power and help us stop them or are you one of them holocaust deniers?

Originally Posted by Shoonra

I have no reason to suppose tht Michael Chertoff is a "fake Jew"; hard to imagine someone opting to be a Jew when he might otherwise join VP Cheney's country club. Michael Chertoff's father was the rabbi of B'nai Israel Synagogue in Elizabeth, NJ, and his mother was a stewardess on ElAl Israeli airlines. Seems plenty real Jews to me.

Michael Chertoff had been US Attorney for NY, and in 2001 was the head of the US Dept of Justice Criminal Division. In 2003 he became a judge in the US Third Circuit Court of Appeals. Two years later he resigned his judgeship to become Secretary of Homeland Security.

So Chertoff wasn't in any position to participate or even observe the attacks of Sept 11th. He came to his position fully four and a half years after the attacks.

So being Chertoff's cousin isn't much of a disgrace. In fact most people raised outside trailer parks would be rather proud to have a federal attorney and judge in the family.

On the other hand, you've been very coy about your family. I can understand that there might be reciprocal shame in that relationship but I have suspected that some of your cousins might be serving more than one purpose on your family tree. In the absence of reliable evidence perhaps we should assume that you descend from some old American family .... like the Jukes.