Child Support when not on Birth Cert.

[Akira]

marksgirl,

Good for you !

Originally Posted by marksgirl

After all the things I've learned this past year, if I could go back and change what I did when I got divorced, I would change a lot. For starters, I wouldn't consider asking for child support enforcement from the state, and I would have asked that it not even be mentioned in the divorce papers. My ex wasn't happy about being separated from his family, but until I filed for cs, he was faithfully giving me money out of his paycheck to cover the mortgage and other expenses. Once I filed, though, he (rightfully) got upset and didn't give me money again. Luckily, my parents were able and willing to help out. I believe that child support enforcement is wrong; the state "government" has no business telling anyone that they have to pay someone else money. I also know my ex; he had some problems but he's still a good man and a good father, and I believe that if I'd never forced the issue, he would still today be sending money to help out, and he'd be happy to do it, too.
I know my opinion probably sounds strange, especially coming from a woman, but gender doesn't change truth. The courts are definitely biased against men. If a game is pre-programmed to have one side always win, where's the honest "victory" in getting something from the other side? There isn't. Nobody wins in divorce, but if you can keep the issues between the two of you and not involve the state, at least nobody LOSES everything.
I have corrected my "error" somewhat by sending the cs "gestapo" my request for them to cease collecting cs from my ex. (I did this months ago) When I called recently to ask how to cancel a cs order, they said, "you sent us a letter back in xxx, so it's already been done." The only thing now that I don't know how to fix (and probably can't) is that I accepted TANF for 6 months, and the cs people are now collecting the amount that he "should have" paid during that time. It's twisted logic; if I didn't have an order to receive cs, they would have wanted me to get one; if I didn't have anyone to get cs from, they still would have given me the same amount of money and would never have expected any of it back. I'm out of their hands now, and have no intentions of ever putting myself, my children, or my ex back in their control again.

I applaud your honesty and clarity...

If the state is using the TANF as an excuse to reinstate the extortion of funds from the ex, correct that also, by insisting on paying it back yourself. As long as you make a payment of $1 a week, they have nothing to say...

Then extend the 'olive branch' and let your ex know what you have done and why...(send him a link to your post !)


For HIS Glory,
Akira

[BOBT12]

Originally Posted by marksgirl

I read this last night, but I couldn't figure out what it had to do with child support. Maybe my brain was just too tired to catch on, but then again... If I'm missing something important, can you please enlighten me? Thanks.
Also, I'd like to throw out my personal opinion/experience here about child support. After all the things I've learned this past year, if I could go back and change what I did when I got divorced, I would change a lot. For starters, I wouldn't consider asking for child support enforcement from the state, and I would have asked that it not even be mentioned in the divorce papers. My ex wasn't happy about being separated from his family, but until I filed for cs, he was faithfully giving me money out of his paycheck to cover the mortgage and other expenses. Once I filed, though, he (rightfully) got upset and didn't give me money again. Luckily, my parents were able and willing to help out. I believe that child support enforcement is wrong; the state "government" has no business telling anyone that they have to pay someone else money. I also know my ex; he had some problems but he's still a good man and a good father, and I believe that if I'd never forced the issue, he would still today be sending money to help out, and he'd be happy to do it, too.
I know my opinion probably sounds strange, especially coming from a woman, but gender doesn't change truth. The courts are definitely biased against men. If a game is pre-programmed to have one side always win, where's the honest "victory" in getting something from the other side? There isn't. Nobody wins in divorce, but if you can keep the issues between the two of you and not involve the state, at least nobody LOSES everything.
I have corrected my "error" somewhat by sending the cs "gestapo" my request for them to cease collecting cs from my ex. (I did this months ago) When I called recently to ask how to cancel a cs order, they said, "you sent us a letter back in xxx, so it's already been done." The only thing now that I don't know how to fix (and probably can't) is that I accepted TANF for 6 months, and the cs people are now collecting the amount that he "should have" paid during that time. It's twisted logic; if I didn't have an order to receive cs, they would have wanted me to get one; if I didn't have anyone to get cs from, they still would have given me the same amount of money and would never have expected any of it back. I'm out of their hands now, and have no intentions of ever putting myself, my children, or my ex back in their control again.

I also agree with Akira's comments.

I am hopeful that you and your ex will come to a fair arrangement for the children sake, I certainly feel that the chances of this are better without the court system.

By the way, it is my observation that many woman have no clear idea what the court/government will do once the child support machine gets into high gear. For instance, the woman may think that she is signing up for some free, or low cost government benefit. However, the nice government employees will ask about the fathers information in a business-as-usual way. At this point, all will seem well.

Later, the court papers go out, the man is furious, yet the woman is just as surprised by the whole issue. While she is aware that she signed up for a benefit, she is unclear about how a court battle got started. Often, upon closer examination of the paperwork (there is lots of paperwork), you find that the woman did not sign a "verification"(OATH) that is needed to start a matter in court. Hence, no Personal Jurisdiction, there is no complaint without a verification! However, you must raise this issue before you do anything else. you must raise the issue without an attorney, or you will waive the Person Jurisdiction issue.

It appears that the government is slow to reveal their true intentions to the woman at the start of the process. I guess that they feel that many women will back out of the system, once they see how small the benefit is, versus the aggravation that is demanded by the system. In any case, it appears that the government has little concern for the family, however, they need a family fight in order to keep expanding their power base.

marksgirl, here is a big thumbs up to you!

Bob

[moorishexecutive]

If this child is yours, this child is your responsibilty. Don't throw your bloodline away because you want to avoid a confrontation with the FOC. Just because your name doesn't appear on the record doesn't mean the child is not yours. That is actually where you are protected against the abuse and tyranny of the state because they have no contract to show that they have the authority to summon you to their courts. Can't oder custody without a contract. My two youngest children gets support from me by way of my obligation to God and that support doesn't only entile FRN's. The FRN's makes it commercial and the taking care of a child is not commercial in the Biblical sense. You are obligated by God because God gave you the ability to create, the state has no power to create anything, nor govern unless you voluntarily give the consent. Tell them to show you proof in documentation that they gave you the power of creation. Don't neglect your son and most importantly show his mother that there is a conspiracy against the both of you, so that she can understand this chaos we find ourselves in.QUOTE=niteuser]Recently, Had fallout with ex-girl friend we had a child but they was unsure about who the father was so they did not put me secured party on the birth cert. But now she is filing a petetion for custody, childsupport , and perternity. against the stawman. I was wondering if possiable I can deny the perternity and some how release myself totally of the child. Heard something at one time you could give over perternal rights to the child. After all she has done I need to just leave em in the dust because she even tried to send me to jail for 60 years over a lie and I was able to get that dropped proved her a lie in court, but I did try to get full custody of the child because of the way she mistreats him, but droped my case agaisnt her and now her lawyer filed this new one trying to get them to order custody, perternity, and child support and she states in it I was present for the birth but not on the certificate because she is unsure. I just want to stay out of the courts and be released of this ongoing miss.

Any Ideas how to respond where they not get orders on me for this?

Best Regards,
niteuser[/quote]

Just an update on this issue,

1. I did get served a summons with an affidavit attached from her saying I was the alleged father. However her ex husband also got the same summons and somehow got out of having to appear in court regardless of the fact they was married at the time of consecption come to find out just recently.

2. Filled notice to proceed asking about jurisdiction within the 10 day period accepted for value the summons and returned to attorney for the state of rehabiltation services.

3. Filled Afidiavit of truth basicly saying no contract exsist and that none will. Also filled protest that she still owes the state child support herself over $8000 dollars now on her other kids yet she has not paid and they tell her she not have to because she is on the state. Yet there was aids of excutions on her in the record. It is so biased its not funny.

4. Court is tommorow FRI 7/14

5. I want to challenge jursidiction not sure on what i should say when the case is called, but going to object to anything her mouthpiece says due to lack of firsthand knowlege and not admit to anything other that i do not understand i do not recall and cannot make a legal determination on what your asking me. In the affidavit of truth there is also a power of attorney she signed to me over the child that is still in effect if she is prevented to care for the child and since she has to have state assistance she is prevented to care? so could i fire the attorney on her side of the court? hummm

6. There also was a notice by written sent to her attorney and her hopefully that will cause yet another ave. of conflict of intrest?

7. I really do not want to be in contempt but I plan to object to any orders forced down my neck. She agreed that we could do private agreement however she dont want to loose her state check so she is doing whatever they want her to. I wanted a private test with no third parties included, however does not look like im going to get that now.

I will hold my ground, because what is going on here is in no way fair, the fact she owes and they represent her the fact that she does not pay and does not go to jail where she belongs is BS the fact that if i miss one payment its back and forth to jail I go. How does that help the child in question if proven it is mine, because she surley is not helping the child with all the unethical drama she puts him in.

God Bless open to any last minute ideas here on a plan of attack.

[Codee]

NOT LEGAL ADVISE. NO RECOURSE. HIRE AN ATTORNEY FOR ADVISE.

If the child bonded with you and concidered you its father and you passivley let it happen then you are going to have to pay child support even if it is not yours. If you had rejected the child from the onset then the mother could have looked for the daddy right away. But if you warmed up to the child then she had a legitamite reason to stop looking because you were being daddy.

Only recourse is for you to find real daddy and prove that he is the dad.

Good Luck

[BOBT12]

Originally Posted by niteuser

Just an update on this issue,

1. I did get served a summons with an affidavit attached from her saying I was the alleged father. However her ex husband also got the same summons and somehow got out of having to appear in court regardless of the fact they was married at the time of consecption come to find out just recently.

Make sure that the affidavit was signed under penalty of perjury. If not, the court has no jurisdiction over this matter at all. The fact that your ex is asking the court to intervene is the main reason the the court may have jurisdiction (a controversy between two parties).

The fact that your ex is alleging that you and her ex-husband are the father of the child should create reasonable doubt in the mind of any jury. If she knew who the father was she should have only picked one man, don't you think?

Of course it is up to you to demand a jury trial. However, I recommend that you attempt to go this way, if the matter goes to trial. See your state constitution for for details.

Originally Posted by niteuser

2. Filled notice to proceed asking about jurisdiction within the 10 day period accepted for value the summons and returned to attorney for the state of rehabiltation services.

I take this to mean that you filed preliminary objections? At least, I hope so.

Originally Posted by niteuser

3. Filled Afidiavit of truth basicly saying no contract exsist and that none will. Also filled protest that she still owes the state child support herself over $8000 dollars now on her other kids yet she has not paid and they tell her she not have to because she is on the state. Yet there was aids of excutions on her in the record. It is so biased its not funny.

4. Court is tommorow FRI 7/14

Good luck.

Originally Posted by niteuser

5. I want to challenge jursidiction not sure on what i should say when the case is called, but going to object to anything her mouthpiece says due to lack of firsthand knowlege and not admit to anything other that i do not understand i do not recall and cannot make a legal determination on what your asking me. In the affidavit of truth there is also a power of attorney she signed to me over the child that is still in effect if she is prevented to care for the child and since she has to have state assistance she is prevented to care? so could i fire the attorney on her side of the court? hummm

If you raise a jurisdictional challenge, such as demanding a jury trial, or perhaps, because the Plaintiff's Affidavit was not signed, do not discuss any other issue until the challenge is ruled upon. If you do, you will waive the challenge.

I certainly would challenge the jurisdiction of a informal hearing. An informal hearing will likely mean that a hearing officer will in effect be judging your case. Press for the jury trial. Needless to say, don't sign any agreement(s) you don't think is/are fair. Instead persue a jury trial.

Originally Posted by niteuser

6. There also was a notice by written sent to her attorney and her hopefully that will cause yet another ave. of conflict of intrest?

Humm?

Originally Posted by niteuser

7. I really do not want to be in contempt but I plan to object to any orders forced down my neck. She agreed that we could do private agreement however she dont want to loose her state check so she is doing whatever they want her to. I wanted a private test with no third parties included, however does not look like im going to get that now.

Unless you and your ex have already signed an agreement, I think this is a closed issue as long as there is an open court case. If there is a signed agreement you can show that there is no controversy between the two parties (you and your ex).

Originally Posted by niteuser

I will hold my ground, because what is going on here is in no way fair, the fact she owes and they represent her the fact that she does not pay and does not go to jail where she belongs is BS the fact that if i miss one payment its back and forth to jail I go. How does that help the child in question if proven it is mine, because she surley is not.

Of course, I don't believe that anyone should be put in jail for this BS.

Originally Posted by niteuser

God Bless open to any last minute ideas here on a plan of attack.

Yes, remember to keep a copy of your state constitution, local rules (if you have them), close at hand. Remind the court that you are innocent until proven guilty by a jury of your peers.

Again, good luck.

BOBT

Originally Posted by BOBT12

Make sure that the affidavit was signed under penalty of perjury. If not, the court has no jurisdiction over this matter at all. The fact that your ex is asking the court to intervene is the main reason the the court may have jurisdiction (a controversy between two parties).

The fact that your ex is alleging that you and her ex-husband are the father of the child should create reasonable doubt in the mind of any jury. If she knew who the father was she should have only picked one man, don't you think?

Of course it is up to you to demand a jury trial. However, I recommend that you attempt to go this way, if the matter goes to trial. See your state constitution for for details.

I take this to mean that you filed preliminary objections? At least, I hope so.

Good luck.

If you raise a jurisdictional challenge, such as demanding a jury trial, or perhaps, because the Plaintiff's Affidavit was not signed, do not discuss any other issue until the challenge is ruled upon. If you do, you will waive the challenge.

I certainly would challenge the jurisdiction of a informal hearing. An informal hearing will likely mean that a hearing officer will in effect be judging your case. Press for the jury trial. Needless to say, don't sign any agreement(s) you don't think is/are fair. Instead persue a jury trial.

Humm?

Unless you and your ex have already signed an agreement, I think this is a closed issue as long as there is an open court case. If there is a signed agreement you can show that there is no controversy between the two parties (you and your ex).


Of course, I don't believe that anyone should be put in jail for this BS.

Yes, remember to keep a copy of your state constitution, local rules (if you have them), close at hand. Remind the court that you are innocent until proven guilty by a jury of your peers.

Again, good luck.

BOBT

Agreed

The Statement done by her was under perjury statement.

Best Regards