* Mirror principle - the register (Certificate of Title) reflects (mirrors) accurately and completely the current facts about a person's title. This means if a person sells an estate, the new title has to be identical to the old one in terms of description of lands, except for the owner's name.
* Curtain principle - one does not need to go behind the Certificate of Title as it contains all the information about the title. This means that ownership need not be proved by long complicated documents that are kept by the owner, as in Private Conveyancing system. All the necessary information regarding ownership is on the Certificate of Title.
* Insurance principle - provides for compensation of loss if there are errors made by the Registrar of Titles. Note that this is not relevant to oil companies due to maximum claims.
Note the bold area in the quote. Split the property into two parcels and the legal description no longer matches. Could this be why property tax stops until a property so divided is recorded again?
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Its' a dog eat dog world and I am wearing milkbone underwear!!!
Since the taxing entity has no knowledge of the division / subdivision of the property until a new or revised recordation occurs, could you please explain what happens to make the taxation on the original property stop?
Since the taxing entity has no knowledge of the division / subdivision of the property until a new or revised recordation occurs, could you please explain what happens to make the taxation on the original property stop?
Good question The answer is "I don't know". Maybe someone here has a better answer.
Say someone has 10 acres and splits it into two parcels, one being 3 acres and the other 7 acres. Once the split has occurred the legal description of neither parcel matches the original description. If the legal description of the property doesn't match then the registration is no good.
Saythe original owner retains the 3 acres and conveys the 7 acres to another who does not record it. My guess would be the original owner would object to continue paying property tax on the whole parcel of 10 acres. I bet he might convey his objection to this situation to the treasurer.
Now if he conveys both parcels to others and no longer has any interest in the property at all I would expect he is going to complain even faster when he continues to receive tax bills in the mail.
Be aware I am not advising anyone to try this. Just investigating the mechanism that drives property tax to better understand its' operation.
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Its' a dog eat dog world and I am wearing milkbone underwear!!!
So, I am making the presumption that many counties still follow the Torrens system even if they say that they do not??? Is this correct or am I off?
- netwrkranger
I believe Torrens has been adopted by every common law country. Read that as any country controlled by the crown.
Though as with everything associated with "law" the Torrens system would seem to be entirely voluntary. Don't register and don't record. Instead post a legal notice for 4 weeks and file a copy of the notice with the recorder as an affidavit.
I asked an attorney once "If there is no debt against the land and I own it free and clear then why am I paying property tax?" His response was to mutter something undecipherable and add several hundred to the bill.
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Its' a dog eat dog world and I am wearing milkbone underwear!!!
If land is not recorded and registered through Torrens then where is it? Is it "within the state" or is it outside the "states" jurisdiction? Does the common law chain of title protect an owners' interest in title to the land from another (even from the state)?
Considering the Torrens' system "insurance principle":
Is the service you are paying for based on the "protection" being provided by the state? If so, is this "protection" the same racket Al Capone pushed on Chicago shopowners? Why are you purchasing "insurance" from the state if not to protect your property from the state?
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Its' a dog eat dog world and I am wearing milkbone underwear!!!
Since the taxing entity has no knowledge of the division / subdivision of the property until a new or revised recordation occurs, could you please explain what happens to make the taxation on the original property stop?
The redemption of lawful money pursuant to Title 12 USC §411 is the only way to actually own property in allodium. One has to quit endorsing the private credit from the Fed. AndyK/KarenM is a Treasury agent who helped teach me the fallacy of considering the NOFTL (Notice of Federal Tax Lien) only a Notice. It is notice to third parties that a lien has already cured by law, due to the fact the party never really paid for the property. The party only discharged credit - passed credit around. See the attached Affidavit of Walker Todd for some details but if you prefer the simplicity of a comic book for 10-year olds:
In reading Walker's testimony you have to pay particular attention to the specification of lawful money of the USA. Then you have to consider its application when you purchase things with lawful money, defeating the Treasury's first lien. Then you might get insight into how the taxation may be stopped on a piece of land.
I have attached a post-1933 paper about recordation too. If you consider its basic precepts, you might understand AndyK/KarenM in violation of Title 31 USC §333 for posting on the Internet at all - especially if he accesses Suijuris from his cubicle even during coffee breaks. Main point is that this cyber-drag queen is a Treasury/IRS agent and if you are not polite, he can start investigating you.
It is worth noting that the fealty to the Pope, which you cited for its explicit mention of the Templar abbey in Dover, is the legal basis for the invalidation of the Magna Carta after it was sealed at Runnymede.
During discussion about the Treaty of 1213 and the Magna Charta (1215).
let's say you have 10 acres. you subdivide into 2 lots of 5 acres each - lot A, the orginal lot and lot B the new lot. Let's say taxes are 4,000 a year. you sell Lot A, which is registered, under a contract to assume "all property taxes registered with the country for parcel # XYZ"....and that they are only buying the 5 acres and that the other 5 acres are not being sold. This way the town is still getting their taxes and there is legally no change to the grand list. but you have relieved yourself from property taxes because you attached the property taxes to a new PRIVATE contract with a new party who will actually assume your taxes for you. It is like you have a kingdom of 10 acres and you leased 5 for rent money. Would that work??? I think it should because again, it's a private contrat and the state is still getting their money.....The town would still consider you owner of the entire 10 acres and perhaps you have really owned "leased" the other 5 acres because the "owner" of Lot A has to pay you a tribute. Hey, this sounds like what THEY have done to ALL of us!!!! Well, I guess we can do it to others - Pagans only of course Perhaps the only draw back is Lot B would lose some benefits - maybe (eg Fire protection, insurance, ability to get a mortgage, mail) - but nothing that would be missed too greatly I suppose. This could be one of those legal loopholes....
Last edited by andrewmitch : 06-09-2008 at 09:24 AM.
Note that this lawful money is in settled "Bills". Anything bought with the settled bills is owned in allodium.
Regards,
David Merrill.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoonra
It is worth noting that the fealty to the Pope, which you cited for its explicit mention of the Templar abbey in Dover, is the legal basis for the invalidation of the Magna Carta after it was sealed at Runnymede.
During discussion about the Treaty of 1213 and the Magna Charta (1215).
How does one own property in allodium if there is a mortgage in place, or a car with a loan. According to the fed, even if we "pay it off" we still didn't pay for it. How do we remedy this situation? How can we actually pay for something we already have in our possession? I understand redeeming lawful money and paying for items with lawful money, but what about items we had prior to this knowledge. Is it as simple as privately selling these items (house,car) to someone and then buying them back with lawful money creating a new bill of sale? I don't know how to do this properly to prove true allodial ownership.
Perhaps the only draw back is Lot B would lose some benefits - maybe (eg Fire protection, insurance, ability to get a mortgage, mail) - but nothing that would be missed too greatly I suppose. This could be one of those legal loopholes....
