Why a Warranty Deed cannot prove Ownership

I asked this offline, but thought it would be best discussed where everyone could chime in.

Why can't a warranty deed prove ownership of land?

HB

Henry:

If a warranty deed is un-contested by a claimant claiming some superrior right to the land, then it is proof of ownership. The contest has to be initiated and concluded before the ownership issue is settled.

So I cannot start an action against the closing attorney and the Grantor of this land to get them to produce certified proof of true title?

Does one have to challenge with a Land Patent?

Or does one (me) have the right to ask for Certified Documentation of True Title to the Land?

The Warranty Deed says they have "the right to convey the same in fee simple, that title is marketable and free and clear of all encumbrances, and that Grantor will warrant and defend the title against lawful claims of all persons whomsoever…”

Can I demand Proof?

HB

Let me answer my own question:

They warrant that they: "will warrant and defend the title against lawful claims of all persons whomsoever…”

If the Bank wants to say they have lawful claim to the land, then the Grantor has just warranted that they will defend the title against that. Right?

HB

Originally Posted by HenryBowman

So I cannot start an action against the closing attorney and the Grantor of this land to get them to produce certified proof of true title?

That is not what is implied Henry. Yes! you can initiate an action with regard to those responsible for the sale and the closing even prior to you having the patent. The point is, they also do not have the patent in their name. As a consequence, they cannot prove the ownership with which they claim on the documents to have. They cannot convey a LAND that they do not have the right to convey. To do so would be a fraudulent representation.

Originally Posted by HenryBowman

Does one have to challenge with a Land Patent?

No. You would be able to acheive this challenge by presenting them with a Demand of Verification (not the VOD that is so often spoken of on this site).. If you need to, ad-lib and design your own Demand.

Originally Posted by HenryBowman

Or does one (me) have the right to ask for Certified Documentation of True Title to the Land?

Because you have a vested interest in the land by virtue of the passage of signed documents, then yes, you have that right.

Originally Posted by HenryBowman

The Warranty Deed says they have "the right to convey the same in fee simple, that title is marketable and free and clear of all encumbrances, and that Grantor will warrant and defend the title against lawful claims of all persons whomsoever…”

Can I demand Proof?

HB

Let me answer my own question:

They warrant that they: "will warrant and defend the title against lawful claims of all persons whomsoever…”

If the Bank wants to say they have lawful claim to the land, then the Grantor has just warranted that they will defend the title against that. Right?

HB

You answered your own question.