Gospel of Thomas

BoyntonStu · #1 12-31-2004, 03:26 AM

“For every woman who has become male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

http://www.gospelthomas.com/

BLATZ

(114) Simon Peter said to them: Let Mariham go out from among us, for women are not worthy of the life. Jesus said: Look, I will lead her that I may make her male, in order that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman who makes herself male will enter into the kingdom of heaven.

LAYTON
(114) Simon Peter said to them, "Mary should leave us, for females are not worthy of life." Jesus said, "See, I am going to attract her to make her male so that she too might become a living spirit that resembles you males. For every female (element) that makes itself male will enter the kingdom of heaven."

DORESSE
118 [114]. Simon Peter says to them: "Let Mary go out from our midst, for women are not worthy of life!" Jesus says: "See, I will draw her so as to make her male so that she also may become a living spirit like you males. For every woman who has become male will enter the Kingdom of heaven."

iamfreeru2 · #2 12-31-2004, 06:19 AM

Stu,

I agree with you this is garbage. I do not know where this came from, but it is certainly not Scripture.

charlesa6 · #3 12-31-2004, 03:30 PM

I concur. Rubbish!!!!

Smart-Aleck · #4 01-04-2005, 03:59 AM

Though the Gospel of Thomas is not widely accepted as being the 'REAL DEAL', the same could be said about the Bible... Either you believe or you don't. There are many passages in the Bible which are just as unsettling as this one, however I personally will not be taking the chances of calling the word of God 'garbage' or 'rubbish' just because I do not fully understand what is being communicated.

Are not the believers supposed to "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your path." ?

iamfreeru2 · #5 01-04-2005, 05:19 AM

Smart-Aleck,

Since this is not from YHWH I will not trust in it. I have yet to have anyone show me anything in the Word of God (Bible) that is unsettling. It may be unsettling to those that do not know Him and that is very understandable in light of what Scripture says. 1 Corinthians 2:14 "But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised." vs. 15 "But he who is spiritual appraises all things, yet he himself is appraised by no man." vs. 16 "For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, THAT HE SHOULD INSTRUCT HIM? But we have the mind of Christ."

Take a look at Acts 17:11(b) "for they received the word with great eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see whether these things were so." I can tell you that based on the Scriptures the above from "The Gospel of Thomas" is dribble. I will always trust in God and He will always direct my paths.

weishaupt1776 · #6 01-04-2005, 04:03 PM

Also, the Gospels & Epistles have tons of reference to the Tanakh's accounts, prophecies & typologies relating to the Messiah. The words in those above passages are inconsistent at best with the character of Yeshua & the apostles when connecting with the 66 books of the Hebrew & Armaic scriptures.

Smart-Aleck · #7 01-04-2005, 07:18 PM

i-mfreeru2 - By what proof can you demonstrate that it is not of YHWH?

weishaupt1776 - Does inconsistency really proove anything? Some say that the last half of Isiah is inconsistent with the first half, are you going to stop reading it?

1 Corinthians

11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
...
11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
11:8 For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man.
11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
11:10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
11: 11Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.
11:12 For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.

iamfreeru2 · #8 01-05-2005, 02:11 AM

Quote:

i-mfreeru2 - By what proof can you demonstrate that it is not of YHWH?

weishaupt1776 - Does inconsistency really proove anything? Some say that the last half of Isiah is inconsistent with the first half, are you going to stop reading it?

1 Corinthians

11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
...
11:7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
11:8 For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man.
11:9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
11:10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
11: 11Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.
11:12 For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.

I do not have to prove anything. Scripture is witness and proof of itself. As I have said before the Holy Spirit gives me the understanding of Scripture and the truth of it. Do you deny that YHWH sent the Holy Spirit for this purpose?

The man that prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonored his head, namely, Christ, the head of every man (v. 3), by appearing in a habit unsuitable to the rank in which God has placed him. We should, even in our dress and habits, avoid every thing that may dishonor Christ. The woman, on the other hand, who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered, dishonored her head, namely, the man, v. 3. The woman should keep to the rank God has chosen for her, and not dishonor her head; for this is to dishonor God. If she was made out of the man, and for the man, and made to be the glory of the man, she should do nothing, especially in public, that looks like a wish of having this order inverted. Unfortunately this happens all the time.

Vs.7 The woman is the glory of the man she is his representative. She is the image of God, inasmuch as she is the image of the man: For the man was not made out of the woman, but the woman out of the man.

Vs. 8 The man was made first, and made head of creation and the woman was made out of the man, and is a reflection of his glory, made superior to the other creations, but in subjection to her husband, and deriving honor from him out of whom woman was made. The woman was made for the man, to be his helpmeet, and not the man for the woman. She was naturally, therefore, made subject to him, because she was created for him, for his use, help, and comfort. She ought to have power on her head, because of the angels. Power, that is, a veil, the token, not of her having the power or superiority, but being under the power of her husband, subjected to him. Rebekah, when she met Isaac, and was delivering herself into his possession, put on her veil, in token of her subjection, Gen. 24:65 Thus would the apostle have the women appear In Christian assemblies, even though they spoke there by inspiration, because of the angels, that is, say some, because of the evil angels. The woman was first in the transgression, being deceived by the devil 1 Tim 2:14, which increased her subjection to man, Gen. 3:16.

Vs. 11, 12: Nevertheless, neither is the man without the woman, nor the woman without the man in the Lord. They were made for one another. It is not good for him to be alone (Gen. 2:18), and therefore the woman was made for the man; and the man was intended to be a comfort, help, and a defense, for the woman. They were made to be a mutual comfort and blessing, not one a slave and the other a tyrant. Both were to be one flesh (Gen. 2:24), and this for the propagation of a race of mankind. They are reciprocal instruments of each other's production. As the woman was first formed out of the man, the woman ever since propagates the man.

(Vs 12), all by the divine wisdom and power of the First Cause so ordaining it. The authority and subjection should be no greater than are suitable to two in such near relation and close union to each other. As it is the will of God that the woman know her place, so it is his will also that the man abuse not his power.

iamfreeru2 · #9 01-05-2005, 02:42 AM

Smart-Aleck,

Tell me, who are the ones that say the first half of Isaiah is inconsistant with the second half. Does God direct error in His word? Is He capable of that? 2Timothy 3:16 "All Scripture is inspired by God (God breathed) and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness." 2 Peter 1:19 " And so we have the prophetic word made more sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts." v. 20 "But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation," v. 21 "for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

I guess what you are telling me is that those that believe there are inconsistancies in YHWH's word are saying they can pick and choose what is correct and not correct. YHWH said what He meant and meant what He said. I do not know about you, but I am going to take YHWH at His word. I am going to allow His Holy Spirit to give me the understanding and if it is in His word then I can take that to the bank. There are no inconsistancies in the Bible and I have yet to have anyone show me any. Now if you are talking about books that claim to be the Bible and are not, that is a different story.

iamfreeru2

Smart-Aleck · #10 01-05-2005, 03:05 AM

Just look on Google if you want to find the ones who believe that Isaiah is authored by multiple individuals, I had read about it a bit ago and don't have the exact link.

"I do not have to prove anything. Scripture is witness and proof of itself. As I have said before the Holy Spirit gives me the understanding of Scripture and the truth of it. Do you deny that YHWH sent the Holy Spirit for this purpose"

No, I do not deny that YHWH sent the Holy Spirit for that purpose, that is why I trust the G.o.T. The Holy Koran is denied by Jews and Christians the world over, but I have had faith that it is also of YHWH.