Merry Christmas ?

[weishaupt1776]

Should the spiritually adopted children of Yehashuah celebrate a pagan holiday?
http://www.sovereigngrace.net/should.htm

It seems like I am forced every year into this "you should be in the Christmas spirit this year" crap.

It is so obvious, that after Christ's death, his birthday (whether in december or not-moot point) was never celebrated. i challenge any one to find this in historical writings or in the Bible.

Dec 25 is some solstice date or some date which is used for pagan observance and was adopted when Constantine started catholicism in the 300's.

He combined Christian and pagan doctrine into one sandwich.

This time of the year is when people really force their religion down your throat

[JWR]

I'm in total agreement weis. I haven't officially done the christmas thing in well over fifteen years. But I usually get it crammed down my throat anyway. And even if it had some backing in the Bible, which I have never found, it has changed to a holiday (holyday?) of greed. And don't quote me on this but I think December 25 has something to do with the inter solstice.

I also believe it was Constantine that forced sunday observance (the first day of the week), which is known as "The Lords Day", from saturday (the seventh day of the week) which is the Sabbath ordained by God. Now almost everyone doesn't know the difference.

But as far as christmas (and especially easter) it is so intertwined with pagan traditions it's hard to tell them apart. I won't even try anymore. And what better way to get more people into your "church" than to make it appealing to just about everyone?

JWR

[idknow]

Originally Posted by weishaupt1776

Should the spiritually adopted children of Yehashuah celebrate a pagan holiday?
http://www.sovereigngrace.net/should.htm

It seems like I am forced every year into this "you should be in the Christmas spirit this year" crap.

It is so obvious, that after Christ's death, his birthday (whether in december or not-moot point) was never celebrated. i challenge any one to find this in historical writings or in the Bible.

Dec 25 is some solstice date or some date which is used for pagan observance and was adopted when Constantine started catholicism in the 300's.

He combined Christian and pagan doctrine into one sandwich.

This time of the year is when people really force their religion down your throat

--

While I am aware of the disconnect tween the date of Joshua's birth, the announcement of that day, the arrival of the Babylonian Seekers and the pagan misinformation --

It is not necessary for me to be "militant" about convincing others of what I know or think I know. God knows my heart well - during all of September (harvest time), I wish my Brother-in-heaven a happy birthday; and during decmeber, Hannukah, I remember the announcement of his birth.

that's how I settle the issue of contamination.

perhaps you readers will be satisfied to consider that way too.

[weishaupt1776]

Originally Posted by idknow

It is not necessary for me to be "militant" about convincing others of what I know or think I know.

I'm not being militant, it seems like the people in churches are being militant in cramming a pagan holiday down my throat and then calling me scrooge, because of some cartoon they saw when they were a kid.

It's the Christmas proponents who are militant

[truthseeker25]

I agree also....I used to celebrate christmas and always looked forward to the day however, ever since i have asked God to show me the way and the truth (about a year ago), i no longer want to celebrate it at all. To me everyday should be a day of giving. When i went to church this sunday ( i know... i should go on the Sabbath) there was so much talk from the pastor about Christmas and Jesus being born on the 25th. I felt like i needed to stop him in front of about 200 people and correct him...but i didnt however i plan to approach him about it later. I know this is not true in regards to Jesus being born on the 25th and i know its real origins, so i feel i should not take part in it at all but i also feel that it is my responsibility to let others of what i know ( and about our goverment also)....and i have...and believe me the response has not been good so far. but its ok...because now I know I have taken the right steps in my journey.

"So Jesus said to those who believed in Him, "If you obey
My teaching, you are really My disciples; you will know
the truth, and the truth will set you free."
John 8:31-32

[Freedomless]

I know my and test my heart daily, trying to keep it in the right light.
Here is another view point.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=47778

[ntellect]

Yeah, this whole Christmas thing and it being Christ's birthday is so confusing for most people. I can't seem to get straight answers from people when I ask them about it. On one hand people say, it's just a celebration of a tradition not supposed to be religious, then turn around and in the same breathe say it's a celebration of the birth of Christ.

When I tell them I don't recall studying any biblical scriptures and finding any scriptural evidence that we are supposed to celebrate Christ's birth or ever finding evidence that Christ said celebrate his birth, they seem to get mad.

If you think about it, biblically speaking, Easter should be the biggest, most grand holiday because I seem to recall the biblical scriptures stating, celebrate Christ's death, burial and ressurection and with pagan belief and traditions, that would be Easter.

Like someone already posted in this forum, these "holidays" have been turned into "holy days" or I guess it can be said in reverse order as well.

My 9 year old daughter just a few weeks ago, possed a question to me that went something like this. "Daddy, if Christmas is supposed to be Jesus birthday, why do we give gifts to each other when it's not our birthday and shouldn't all the gifts go to Jesus?" From the mind of a child, much can be learned. Nuff said.

Originally Posted by ntellect

Yeah, this whole Christmas thing and it being Christ's birthday is so confusing for most people. I can't seem to get straight answers from people when I ask them about it. On one hand people say, it's just a celebration of a tradition not supposed to be religious, then turn around and in the same breathe say it's a celebration of the birth of Christ.

.

Agree. It's all very confusing and non-sensical to me. Have you ever thought about the possibility of all this religious/bible stuff being just one big scam?

[Freedomless]

Here is the article that I posted the link to.


Are Christmas trees pagan?



Posted: December 7, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern
By Gary DeMar
© 2005 WorldNetDaily.com
One group of Christians is trying to keep the name "Christmas tree" rather than the non-descript "Holiday tree," while a small minority of Christians wants to say good riddance to the very idea of Christmas trees because their origin is pagan. Who's right?
Some time ago, my wife was asked by a national ministry to create a quilted backdrop of a large sweeping rainbow for its presentation booth that was used at various conventions around the country. I happened to attend one that was held in Atlanta. I went over to the booth and told the young lady behind the table that my wife had sewn the large background piece. With a frustrated look on her face, she told me that a woman had just left the booth angrily pointing out that the rainbow is the symbol of the homosexual movement and that Christians should not be using it.
I reminded her that the rainbow was God's creation, and that He had posted it in the heavens as a sign to Noah and future generations that He would never destroy all flesh by a flood (Genesis 9:12–17).
So then, who owns the rainbow? Homosexuals or the people of God? Just because homosexuals have misappropriated something of God's good creation does not mean we cannot continue to use it. In fact, we should work to restore the image to its original redemptive meaning. Instead, many Christians refuse to display the rainbow because it has been hijacked by a group who flaunts a particular lifestyle that is condemned by the Bible.
Should we stop using wood because some people seek out for themselves "a skillful craftsman to prepare an idol that will not totter" (Isaiah 40:20)? Are all trees pagan because pagans have used trees to create idols? Of course not. The Bible tells us, even in a post-fall world, "everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected, if it is received with gratitude" (1 Timothy 4:4; cf. Genesis 1:31).
For millennia idol worshippers have bowed down before heavenly bodies – sun, moon, and stars – calling them their gods. There were people in Isaiah's day who looked to "astrologers, those who prophesy by the stars, those who predict by the new moons" seeking guidance (Isaiah 47:13). The people of Israel were warned by God not to lift their "eyes to heaven and see the sun and the moon and the stars, all the host of heaven, and be drawn away and worship them and serve them, those which the LORD your God has allotted to all the peoples under the whole heaven" (Deuteronomy 4:19).
God created the heavenly bodies to "be for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years," and to "be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the Earth" (Genesis 1:14). Even with the misuse of the heavenly bodies, this did not stop God from choosing the sun, moon, and stars to symbolize His chosen nation Israel (Genesis 37:9–11; Revelation 12:1–2). And neither did it stop Him from using a star to announce the birth of Jesus (Matthew 2:2).
Some will turn to Jeremiah 10:1-10 to make a case against "Christmas trees." Jeremiah is describing idol worship, and he ridicules it: "Like a scarecrow in a cucumber field are they, and they cannot speak; they must be carried, because they cannot walk! Do not fear them, for they can do no harm, nor can they do any good" (10:5). Who among us believes that a "Christmas tree" is a god to be worshipped?
Just because pagans might have used trees to worship their gods does not mean that we can't use them to teach us something about God who has given us the "indescribable gift" of Jesus Christ (2 Corinthians 9:15). The Christmas tree, as it is now designated, is an evergreen that reminds us that we have "eternal life" in Jesus Christ (John 6:40). The shape of the tree reminds us that we are "born from above" (John 3:3). The needles on the branches remind us that Jesus was "pierced through for our transgressions" (Isaiah 53:5).
The lights hung on the tree remind us that Jesus is "the light of the world" (John 8:12) and through Him we are to be "the light of the world" (Matthew 5:14). The ornaments we hang on the tree and the presents we place under the tree remind us that "every good thing given and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variation or shifting shadow" (James 1:17).
Instead of condemning the Christmas tree as some pagan object brought into our homes from the pagan cold, it can be used to remind us that God promises us "the right to the tree of life" (Revelation 22:14).
If the Bible tells us "to go to the ant ... to observe her ways and be wise" (Proverbs 6:6), certainly we can learn similar things from God's other good creations, even trees.

[ntellect]

Originally Posted by PJT04

Agree. It's all very confusing and non-sensical to me. Have you ever thought about the possibility of all this religious/bible stuff being just one big scam?

PJT04, yes I have thought about this posibility but I go back to what I have felt in my heart or spirit/soul. I know there's more to it than what meets the eye. I believe the problem is most people don't want to find the truth. Once again, I quote a line from my favorite movie the Matrix, "Ignorance is bliss..." because there is no knowledge and without knowledge there is no responsibility.

PJT04, in this existence, anything is possible.

Peace and Blessings