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Old 08-14-2004, 04:25 PM
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My view on our responsibility,,,

I had a friend ask me "IF I vote to allow certain things that I feel are wrong (ie through voting for a presidential candidate that would), that in some way I am giving that behavior my blessing and condoning it for my children, etc.... How do you personally reconcile the two in your heart?" and here is my response. anyone want to add to it?



I can SO Totally see where you are coming from. (oh, no problem, I don't mind you bringing it up). In fact, even 4 months ago I would have been saying the same thing. It has only been recently that I have really been convicted of this. Oh gosh, where to begin!?! There is a lot to it...



Let's look at the word "ekklesia" in the Bible (this is the word that is translated "church" in the NT); part of its definition is: a gathering of citizens called out from their homes into some public place, an assembly



Notice the word "citizens" there. Now, how about more of its definition:

Quote:
d) in a Christian sense



1) an assembly of Christians gathered for worship in a religious meeting



2) a company of Christian, or of those who, hoping for eternal salvation through Jesus Christ, observe their own religious rites, hold their own religious meetings, and manage their own affairs, according to regulations prescribed for the body for order's sake



3) those who anywhere, in a city, village, constitute such a company and are united into one body



4) the whole body of Christians scattered throughout the earth



5) the assembly of faithful Christians already dead and received into heaven



Okay, so the church is a gathering of CITIZENS to hold and observe religious rites, worship, and is scattered throughout the earth.



CITIZENS you say? Citizens.. interesting. Well, doesn't the Word say in Matthew 24:14 that we are to proclaim the Gospel of the Kingdom? We are citizens of THAT kingdom. Our true citizenship is not here on earth, it is of God's kingdom, and Jesus as the King. And that is how the Apostles walked on the earth, after Christ ascended back to Heaven.



They knew that they were citizens of Yahweh's kingdom. They did not let Rome or any other gov't "get to" them. (I mean, their rules, policies, laws, etc be a burden/bring concern to them) I mean, think of Peter who was told to not preach anymore... he said he did what the FATHER permitted him - why? b/c it's HIS kingdom he was a part of. It was by their life and witness that others were changed. Not by legislating morality. People were won to the Lord b/c of the freedom they saw in Christ - not just from sin but oppressive laws. (The is my belief) Rome was getting scared because they saw the citizens of Yaweh's kingdom acting with the authority given to them by their KING. They needed these people under their own control (Hmmm... maybe why the Catholic church got in bed with Rome???) so as not to loose them to another king. That is why they were so scared of Christ as King. It was not only a spiritual thing but it was REAL. (Side note: Remember - the Jews don't believe that Jesus was the King and they were looking for a literal king. He IS a literal king of his kingdom, think about it - he'd have to be to fulfill scripture)



Okay, so where am I going with this rant in response to your question!?! I'm getting there.



Now, let's think about how this country was founded. The creators and signers of the Constitution wanted us to have freedom to choose. They knew how important this was to God. They operated under GOD being their King. Ie - they knew that GOD gave them the right to travel, therefore no need for Driver's Liscenses. It was a RIGHT given to us by our Creator, not a priviledge. (yes, I know they didn't have cars but horses and such. but they could have limited that too, yk) So, freedom to choose who we worship, how we live, etc.



So, if that is HOW this country was founded, should we not try to get back to it? And if you are voting for a person that condones it (something that you don't agree with), no, I don't believe you are condoning it. Take homosexual unions - they should not be banned JUST BECAUSE THE CONSTITUTION does not limit it. I don't believe homosexuals should be married - but God did give us the choice to reject him or not to. ME voting for it doesn't say I want them to get married, but that I recognize we can choose to eat of the tree or to leave it alone. Yes, some might recognize it as me saying I believe homosexual marriage is proper - but I will set them straight.



See, our heart should be trying to live our OWN LIVES as Christ is KING. And if we are doing that that is all that matters. For we know our kingdom is with HIM. Think about how much MORE EFFECTIVE the witnessing would be if the enitre Ekklesia would live as Christ as the KING and we are part of his Kingdom. Then we wouldn't have to be concerned with legislating marriages or not. Our witnessing would be the seed - not legislation.



We have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in this country. If someone believes that they would be happy in a homosexual union, or traveling without car insurance, or own rental property and rent to ANYONE they want to and be allowed some discretion in the matter - then SO BE IT! What were Jesus' commands? First, love the Lord with all your heart.... wouldn't recognizing his kingdom and authority fall under that? And do unto others as you would have them do to you/love your neighbor as thyself.. wouldn't the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness fall under that?



One more thing: When you think about how we are citizens of Yahweh's Kingdom - what does that mean the Bible is? Maybe you could look at it as our Code of Conduct? So, it is for Believers/Citizens only....THEREFORE the "codes" don't apply to non-citizens. SO, ie homosexual union.... doesn't make any difference to the non-citizens of heaven what our "code" says. it doesn't apply to them.



Think about these verses in light of Christ being our king and ruler of our government:



Quote:
Isa 9:6

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.



Isa 9:7 Of the increase of [his] government and peace [there shall be] no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever.



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Old 08-14-2004, 11:53 PM
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scottinalaska scottinalaska is offline
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My view on our responsibility,,,

JSO,

I too frustrate people when I ask them what business do we have wringing our hands when our government is debating homosexual marriage licenses.

I didn't always think this way. I was VERY outspoken about the wrongness of the lifestyle and still feel that is a most unhealthy choice and is sin.

BUT, when we gave the govt permission to grant us permission to marry - a license - we gave them permission to define the creation and dissolution of the same. Divorce is easy now. It wasn't alway so.

So...are our licensed marriages here in America a Christian kind of Biblical marriage? Harldy anymore.

"By the power vested in me by the State of _____, I pronounce you..."

Hello? Since when do we need to be State empowered for something that used to be simply recorded in the family Bible? This is a State marriage and as was stated by JSO, "it doesn't make any difference to the non-citizens of heaven what our code says." Sure there are Biblical mandates, but they are for Biblical Christians.

And we are going to place THAT on NONBiblical citizenry? On something we already gave up to the State?

Just a little bit of truth has DEstressed me on the issue actually. Done again, I would not have registered MY marriage!

scottinalaska
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Old 12-12-2004, 12:12 AM
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weishaupt1776 weishaupt1776 is offline
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good post 2501, If youu wanted to, you could click edit button in the lower right corner of your original post, and insert your additions there instead of doing three posts in a row.
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