Successfully avoiding a vehicle search!

[Dillon Hunt]

Originally Posted by Shoonra

No. IF there had been probable cause to stop the car - for ANY reason, such as taillight out or speeding, THEN the cops have the right to demand to see the DL and the driver has the legal duty to present it - and his failure to do so can be a separate or additional charge. Additionally, any other offenses "in plain sight" such as something illegal that can be seen through the windshield or windows may also be added.

The cracked windsheild is not listed on the ticket (the reason for the stop) is it? So, no PC for checking the docuements of the driver. The Officer can't just put over anyone to check for DL, etc.

That is why it is a good idea to ask what his/her PC was for the Apprehension.

[heyday]

I'm not Uncle Bernie but I can't resist...

Originally Posted by mrg

Uncle Bernie:

What, precisely is "legal trend of thought?"

Whatever silly legal mandate SCOTUS dreams up from day to day.


Is that like a "fad?"

Pretty close. You certainly may never depend on an "inalienable right" because you only have same until some silly and illogical Supreme Court Opinion takes it away.

Is it akin to "current federal law?"

Pretty close. Maybe like first cousins of the inbred variety

[artificialsteve]

Originally Posted by David Merrill

I have noted the latest:



I of course read into that question "contraban". - "Do you have any needles, knives or drugs in your pockets?"

My answering the question at all was construed as permission to pat me down. Then the officer came across my gloves in the cargo pocket on my pants:



See? Now he had caught me in a lie. I did have something in my pockets - gloves.

Do not appear to be giving consent to questioning by answering any questions other than your name. Do not even give a DOB. Answer questions, No man can be compelled to incriminate himself.

And of course, like shown here, make it clear when they proceed on consent that you expressly withdraw any such presumption.



Regards,

David Merrill.

This is true. I know from experience that all you are required to give them is your name. Here's the problem David; I am too chicken to do this while in a vehicle. If I were ANYWHERE else you better beleive they would only get my name. Any advice for next time? What's the worst case scenario, in our traffic stop situation?

[artificialsteve]

Originally Posted by Livefire

Lets face it, the defective equipment gave them PC to stop the vehicle. The request for search was a fishing expedition that was successfully diverted. Most likely, the cop profiled you (they have a record of nailing people for other things besides the equipment problem). Check the citation to see if the offenses are correctable (i.e. having a police officer sign off the ticket, as in the case of an equipment problem)

If that isnt the case you can always try Ticketslayer if there is time to default them.

An entire cop's day is a fishing expedition! Unless of course an actual injured party exists, eh?
In my small town of upper middle class white people, the cops are always in need of something to do. This is not good. There is always the fear that I will be stopped by a cop and asked simply "What are you doing?"
Pretty stupid, but it works on other uninformed and blindly dutiful 'citizens' around here.....(sigh)

[artificialsteve]

Originally Posted by Dillon Hunt

The cracked windsheild is not listed on the ticket (the reason for the stop) is it? So, no PC for checking the docuements of the driver. The Officer can't just put over anyone to check for DL, etc.

That is why it is a good idea to ask what his/her PC was for the Apprehension.

I did get cited for the cracked windshield, I didn't even realize it until I rechecked the ticket.

Yeah, I am really pissed about the whole thing, because the cop was going to find anything he could wrong, make the ticket as big and scary as possible, and then go in for the search after that to maximize his profits. Lol, maybe he thinks I am stupid AND rich!

[David Merrill]

Originally Posted by artificialsteve

This is true. I know from experience that all you are required to give them is your name. Here's the problem David; I am too chicken to do this while in a vehicle. If I were ANYWHERE else you better beleive they would only get my name. Any advice for next time? What's the worst case scenario, in our traffic stop situation?

For $26 you can get a Certificate of Search from your nearest federal courthouse USDC.

http://friends-n-family-research.inf..._falsified.jpg
http://friends-n-family-research.inf..._corrected.jpg

Several suitors listened and signed the State's driver licenses First Middle dba FIRST MIDDLE LAST and the State swapped out the digital signature pads for smaller ones. So now I suggest that you sign First Middle clearly. But even that is not all that important unless you consider the police might lie later or just say, "I don't remember you saying anything like that."

Hand them the driver license with the Certificate of Search and make it clear that you are not identifying yourself with the Driver License. That is not your name. If you have signed First Middle then point out that is your name; not FIRST M. LAST. Now you have set the record up for you to be the man or woman using the artifice in commerce. Men and women have God-given unalienable rights - not artifices created by the State.

In order to reduce the right to travel to a privilege, they must first confuse you about your identity. Notice the dates on the above linked Certificate of Search. Jim still sends a lot of suitor referrals my way...




Regards,

David Merrill.


P.S. Typical Noachide license image attached.

[farmer_giles_of_ham]

Granted all of the above- what is the net effect?

To me it looks like the procedure outlined above takes one out of the domestic state license and into the international. And also sets the stage to demand remedy against compelled funding of the claim with private bank credit.

The state still retains jurisdiction over the use of the roads, and that means exposure to fines and other penalties.

Although as indicated, the demand for money is met by the BoEx implied above- cant be held to involuntary service of using private credit, no contract. And they cant take gold or silver, so no recourse= refusal for cause.

And if all penalties can be reduced to a current value, and covered with a BoE...then the whole thing becomes largely moot.

[fulltitle]

Originally Posted by David Merrill

Do not appear to be giving consent to questioning by answering any questions other than your name. Do not even give a DOB. Answer questions, No man can be compelled to incriminate himself.

And of course, like shown here, make it clear when they proceed on consent that you expressly withdraw any such presumption.

Without Prejudice.
First thing you can say is: "I do not wish to contract with you." (Verbal R4C) That pretty much kills a lot of presumptions.

[fulltitle]

Originally Posted by artificialsteve

This is true. I know from experience that all you are required to give them is your name. Here's the problem David; I am too chicken to do this while in a vehicle. If I were ANYWHERE else you better beleive they would only get my name. Any advice for next time? What's the worst case scenario, in our traffic stop situation?

Without Prejudice.
To knowledge, a business card suffices as identification. You arent required to give them your name just tell it to them. If someone asks "May I have your name?" I'd reply "No I like my name I want to keep it. But I can tell you what it is."

Originally Posted by artificialsteve

An entire cop's day is a fishing expedition! Unless of course an actual injured party exists, eh?
In my small town of upper middle class white people, the cops are always in need of something to do. This is not good. There is always the fear that I will be stopped by a cop and asked simply "What are you doing?"
Pretty stupid, but it works on other uninformed and blindly dutiful 'citizens' around here.....(sigh)

I have seen a case thrown out based on lack of probable cause. The judge/referee didnt flinch when he threw it out. In that case, the cop made stop without any reason and then wrote a ticket for lack of insurance. He didnt have any reason whatsoever for making the stop therefore everything else arising from the 'stop' was moot and the judge/referee agreed without hesitation and moved on to the next case.

Re: fishing expidition. Admiralty...sea....paper hooks. Are you a fish?

Originally Posted by David Merrill

For $26 you can get a Certificate of Search from your nearest federal courthouse USDC.

This should serve to save quite a bit of time.

Several suitors listened and signed the State's driver licenses First Middle dba FIRST MIDDLE LAST and the State swapped out the digital signature pads for smaller ones. So now I suggest that you sign First Middle clearly. But even that is not all that important unless you consider the police might lie later or just say, "I don't remember you saying anything like that."

"First" "Middle", as Agent would be better IMHO.

Hand them the driver license with the Certificate of Search and make it clear that you are not identifying yourself with the Driver License. That is not your name. If you have signed First Middle then point out that is your name; not FIRST M. LAST. Now you have set the record up for you to be the man or woman using the artifice in commerce. Men and women have God-given unalienable rights - not artifices created by the State.

If they point to the DL and ask "Is this you?" keep in mind that unless you are a piece of plastic with a photo and artwork on it and a bunch of cryptic glyphs on it then weigh the merits of saying yes carefully if not prayerfully.

In order to reduce the right to travel to a privilege, they must first confuse you about your identity. Notice the dates on the above linked Certificate of Search. Jim still sends a lot of suitor referrals my way...

I do not have any driver license or ID issued by any State of the United States. My inalienable right to travel brings an implied license with it. I have the right to transport my own possessions or property on the public highways or on the common ways. Because a State paves my paths for its own convenience does not give the State the right to tell me what I can or cannot do on those paths.

Consider the notion of a a mechanic's lien on a house. It might be one thing if only I used "the house" (i.e. paths in the woods called common ways or highways or roads). But in with roads, the State also uses the house for its commercial affairs so the obligations are pretty much cancelled out. It paved my paths in the woods for its convenience and enhanced the value of my paths but for its own benefit.

If 100 businesses shared a path in the woods and 80 of them used it so much that they wanted it to be paved, the other 20 dont necessarily have any obligation to those that did the paving. Why? Because unlike a typical mechanic's lien the 80 that paved it are gaining from it and using the paved surface together with the underlying road. Those 80 who use the path enough did the paving for their own benefit. If the other 20 didnt require it its not their problem. The other 80 probably increased their revenues and reduced truck maintenance or something along those lines anyways right?

If Bob takes Joe's popsicles and coats them with chocolate and put them back in Joe's fridge its one thing. But if Bob coats them and eat them, wouldn't Bob owe Joe in face of any potential mechanic's lien on Bob's part? Could Joe not charge Bob for the underlying popsicle that Bob ate just as much as Bob might like to charge Joe for the added chocolate coating?

P.S. Typical Noachide license image attached.

Stay out of their courts.

[fulltitle]

Originally Posted by artificialsteve

This is true. I know from experience that all you are required to give them is your name. Here's the problem David; I am too chicken to do this while in a vehicle. If I were ANYWHERE else you better beleive they would only get my name. Any advice for next time? What's the worst case scenario, in our traffic stop situation?

Without Prejudice.
To knowledge, a business card suffices as identification. You arent required to give them your name just tell it to them. If someone asks "May I have your name?" I'd reply "No I like my name I want to keep it. But I can tell you what it is."