Beating the Debt Collector.

BOBT12 · #1 08-19-2005, 04:40 PM

Following troubles relating to my former bank (Citizens Bank), which I am still in the process of suing, and the IRS; there was an outstanding issue due to bounced checks on my account. When the bank gave the IRS the contents of my account, based on a phony "Notice of Levy" (NOL), several of my outstanding checks did not clear. As you may have guessed, by the time that the bank informed me of the NOL the checks were already written and mailed. The bank covered the payments of the checks. However, they, in turn, charged me for the amount of the checks that they covered, and, in addition, charged me bounced check fees.

Of course, I refused to pay. I did not authorize the bank to release my funds to the IRS. As soon as I received notice of what was going on, I demanded that the bank NOT honor the NOL.

In June I received a letter from NCO FINANCIAL SYSTEMS INC (NCO). The letter stated, in part, "The named creditor (CITIZENS BANK-DDA) has placed this account with our office for collection. It is important that you forward payment in full."

In response, I sent them the two page "Validation of Dept" letter. I got this form letter from the Download section.

Yesterday NCO replied to my VOD, "Thank you for your letter regarding the above-referenced (CITIZENS BANK) account. Please be advised that the above-referenced account is closed in our office...Unless notified to the contrary, we shall cease further attempts to communicate with you concerning the above account."

Thank you sui juris, and crew!

For more information:

http://forum.suijuris.net/showthread.php?t=2955

http://famguardian.org/forums/index....&hl=bank&st=15

http://famguardian.org/forums/index....ic=485&hl=bank

theghost · #2 08-19-2005, 07:01 PM

Bobt12, when you signed the signature card at that bank, you unknowingly agreed to all the codes, rules, regulatiuons, and statutes, both state and federal, which includes title 26. The bank will NEVER honor your request over the IRS's to turn over money, NEVER! You will not win this one. Read George Mercier's Invisible Contracts, a letter to Armen Condo, for a full explanation of this. Congrats on the other issue though!

BOBT12 · #3 08-19-2005, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theghost

Bobt12, when you signed the signature card at that bank, you unknowingly agreed to all the codes, rules, regulatiuons, and statutes, both state and federal, which includes title 26. The bank will NEVER honor your request over the IRS's to turn over money, NEVER! You will not win this one. Read George Mercier's Invisible Contracts, a letter to Armen Condo, for a full explanation of this. Congrats on the other issue though!

So far, the attorney for the bank has not raised the issue that you mention, in their Preliminary Objections, regarding my pending suit. Also, according to several court rulings, I feel that you are incorrect:

BOULDER

http://www.wealth4freedom.com/truth/levycase.htm

Schulz v. IRS

http://www.givemeliberty.org/RTPLaws...2005-07-04.htm

In any case, if I did not know about the item, then I could not have agreed. There was no meeting of the minds (fraud).

In any event, there is no one requiring me to pay the dept at this point. Thus, I will not pay.

iamfreeru2 · #4 08-19-2005, 07:30 PM

Theghost, you may want to look at this http://forum.suijuris.net/showthread...5322#post35322, as you are wrong about your statement:

Quote:

Originally Posted by theghost

The bank will NEVER honor your request over the IRS's to turn over money, NEVER! You will not win this one.

I beg to differ with you that "You will never win this one. Check out my attachment in the above thread.

iamfreeru2 · #5 08-19-2005, 08:41 PM

Sorry Bob, did not know you posted the Boulder case. I have the PDF version with copies of the actual court docs in the other thread I posted above as an attachment.

BOBT12 · #6 08-19-2005, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamfreeru2

Sorry Bob, did not know you posted the Boulder case. I have the PDF version with copies of the actual court docs in the other thread I posted above as an attachment.

That is fine with me.

seeker · #7 08-20-2005, 09:29 AM

Not sure how much you want to push this, but check out the "closed account checks" thing -- the theory is sound -- the 'public' side of the account is closed, but the private side is still open and operating for 'transfers' ie. DISCHARGE of debt.

I know Jean Keating and Jack smith both talk about using checks of closed accounts to satisfy debts -- Jack in his "lost letter of credit' seminar, spoke specifcally about the exact senario you are describing. The IRS took the check, after the account was closed by the bank, and said, "Thank you very much", when they came for another year, she gave them another check. Again they accepted.

Jean Keating talks about doing it with WalMart -- just letting the attorney who called and said, "What are we going to do about this?" know that it was now in HIS Ballgame to 'discharge' the debt, which he did.

Some of those takes are at http://neopa.net/jacksmith/

We have thought about pushing the bank in our case when they emptied the account for a "creditor' -- I think I will now send them a letter saying, "As my fiduciary, please process this check for the settlement and closure of the account you initiated with Creditor X. I look forward to your report on closing this matter with all haste."

JMHO.

Seeker

BOBT12 · #8 08-20-2005, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seeker

Not sure how much you want to push this, but check out the "closed account checks" thing -- the theory is sound -- the 'public' side of the account is closed, but the private side is still open and operating for 'transfers' ie. DISCHARGE of debt.

I know Jean Keating and Jack smith both talk about using checks of closed accounts to satisfy debts -- Jack in his "lost letter of credit' seminar, spoke specifcally about the exact senario you are describing. The IRS took the check, after the account was closed by the bank, and said, "Thank you very much", when they came for another year, she gave them another check. Again they accepted.

Jean Keating talks about doing it with WalMart -- just letting the attorney who called and said, "What are we going to do about this?" know that it was now in HIS Ballgame to 'discharge' the debt, which he did.

Some of those takes are at http://neopa.net/jacksmith/

We have thought about pushing the bank in our case when they emptied the account for a "creditor' -- I think I will now send them a letter saying, "As my fiduciary, please process this check for the settlement and closure of the account you initiated with Creditor X. I look forward to your report on closing this matter with all haste."

JMHO.

Seeker

Wow, I love it! Of course it will take some time to digest and apply this information.

Again, thank you. It is great to see people helping each other, as witnessed here, at sui juris.