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  #21  
Old 11-18-2006, 07:37 AM
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charlesa6 charlesa6 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by idknow
but for a win, there is suprisingly little info.

is there any update of info available?
Jerrypitts, take the time out, he will be back to answer the entire controversy in question.
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Last edited by charlesa6 : 11-18-2006 at 08:36 AM.
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  #22  
Old 12-15-2006, 10:44 PM
logos logos is offline
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folks,

What you seek, the codification of the principle "payment refused is debt forgiven," can be found as your state's enactment of UCC § 3-603(b).
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  #23  
Old 12-15-2006, 10:57 PM
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Thanks for the feedback. You think that is the key factor for put it off.
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  #24  
Old 12-16-2006, 12:09 AM
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Re: tendering notes for discharge

I think the main problem is that, while governmental entities probably can take a note at face value, non-governmental entities probably can't because they'll have to have their bank process it, and the bank will probably only take it at a discount and charge interest for handling it. This may explain why a poster, who in another thread claimed to have tendered a note to a debt collector, only received a partial credit. I'd bet it's because the d.c.'s bank wouldn't take the note at face.

A debt collector friend ("Stan") has seen this work from the inside as mentioned here. To elaborate on that post, his boss received a note from a debtor but didn't know what to do with it and asked Stan to look at it. His boss was ready to discard the note when Stan advised him not to do that as UCC § 3-603(b) may apply, but to instead call their bank. His boss was instructed by Webster Bank to send the note to a facility in Toledo, Ohio via registered mail--a big requirement--addressed to someone who's either in charge of or an important player in Webster's Billing & Receiving Dept. A search on Webster's site shows no indication of their having a branch out there. Anyhow, after processing something would be returned to the company via registered mail. Of course the bank must have charged interest, as discussed in the above thread. I can only assume Stan's company absorbed it probably because the interest would be tax deductible. His boss didn't copy the note prior to mailing and Stan can't ask the auditor for a printout of that account's activity without raising eyebrows, so we can't substantiate any of this.

BTW, this is the same friend who, I claimed in an older thread, discharged his Federal student loan with a note. In that case, too, it was required he send his note via registered mail to the top man of that loan program. I think I read an old post wherein it was claimed a federal court ruled/admitted that sending instruments via registered mail renders them obligations of the U.S., or something like that.

The point to keep in mind is that non-gov entities probably won't know how to enter the note on their ledgers, hence their inclination to discard them. It's easy to forget that while we may have knowledge of some of these things, the rank & file of most entities are often less knowledgable. They're not necessarily giving us a hard time just for amusement. As someone noted, you'll probably need to deal with someone higher up like the CFO, but sometimes someone high enough who interfaces with that entity's bank will do.

Inform that individual you'll be tendering a note, notarized with the maker's SSN, but you need for them to call their bank and find out at what ratio the bank will take it, and how much interest the bank will charge on the discount amount of $XXX.XX. It's unlikely a local branch will process the note, so they'll be given special mailing instructions. The creditor should be willing to absorb the interest if it can be deducted from its taxes. If you sound like you know what you're talking about and claim you've done this before, they may be more accomodating. If the creditor is still reluctant (my current case), get their banking coordinates and try to deal with their bank directly. However, you'll have to pay the interest.
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  #25  
Old 12-16-2006, 12:22 AM
Notorial dissent Notorial dissent is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by logos
folks,

What you seek, the codification of the principle "payment refused is debt forgiven," can be found as your state's enactment of UCC § 3-603(b).

This applies ONLY to paying off negotiable instruments, nothing else, specifically a promissory note, not debts in general, also still subject to payment terms of the note which usually specify what is acceptable payment.
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  #26  
Old 12-16-2006, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Notorial dissent
This applies ONLY to paying off negotiable instruments, nothing else, specifically a promissory note, not debts in general, also still subject to payment terms of the note which usually specify what is acceptable payment.
Could you clarify your statement? How would one "pay off" a negotiable instrument without using another negotiable instrument? That's all we use. What do you call "debts in general?" lol

Last edited by logos : 12-16-2006 at 12:51 AM.
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  #27  
Old 12-16-2006, 09:00 AM
Shoonra Shoonra is offline
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UCC 3-603(b) does not forgive debts, but it discharges the obligation of an endorser (i.e. NOT the debtor) if the payment is refused.

There is not much litigation on this subsection but it has been held that (1) payment must be tendered, meaning that the money itself must be presented -- not a document containing an offer or a proposed compromise or some form of funny money. Davis v. Dillard National Bank (MD NC 6/4/03) 50 UCC Rptg Serv.2d 877; and (2) the debtor, the signer of the promissory note or whatever document was obligation, remains liable for the amount which was refused even though intermediaries like endorsers are freed of liability. Guaranty Bank & Trust Co. v. Dowling (1985) 4 Conn.App 376, 494 A2d 1216, 59 ALR4th 605, 41 UCC Rptg Serv 1353 app.denied 197 Conn 808, 499 A2d 58.
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  #28  
Old 12-16-2006, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlesa6
Jerrypitts, take the time out, he will be back to answer the entire controversy in question.

No. Jerrypitts is hanging out on another forum and posting. He has still not shed any light on this.
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  #29  
Old 12-16-2006, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Codee
No. Jerrypitts is hanging out on another forum and posting. He has still not shed any light on this.
Ain't that the truth? I hear you.
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  #30  
Old 12-16-2006, 07:44 PM
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ndusa ndusa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Codee
No. Jerrypitts is hanging out on another forum and posting. He has still not shed any light on this.

I would think with a "win" like that, you don't need time to put it on here. WE hear all kinds of wins, but never see the papers to back it up.
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