ready to break

[Ice]

We're kinda off the beaten path here... this is good country. The hunting is great. We tapped into an underground spring and we won't have to worry about being short on water.

The fact that the members are spread out across the country is neither here nor there. macerico, I'll bet you have friends or family that might be interested in something like this... the same goes for the rest of the members. And the members can form their own coalition(s), deciding on a where and how to fulfill this goal. Like I said, it's something to think about.

At the moment I'm thinking about electricity... generating it ourselves. We have a canal that runs along our property... but it doesn't run all that fast. We also have good winds. There is a river across a field from us (land owned by a friend). We seem to have plenty of options for generating our own electricity. Generating it is one thing... storing it is the next step. If anyone has any ideas on these issues, I'm all ears.

Ice

[SKYGZR]

Originally Posted by HenryBowman

Does your wife let you partake? If so, tell me how you convinced her.

Thanks

Henry Franklin


P.S. If you can show me in the bible where cows milk (organic) is bad or forbidden, then I might listen. Otherwise, there are a hundred or more opinions. Mine works for me, yours works for you.

A cursory glance at your links let me know that they are grasping at anything that sounds bad.

Hey HB, No "wife" at this time, had one for 10 years, that was 10 years ago. Once weened, NO species of animal continues to consume the milk of it's own species....except for humans....and it's not of the same species, nothing biblical, just abnormal and unhealthy. Now we could get into discussing the fact that humans don't have the digestive tract designed to digest meat..(that's a cat..), nor the teeth as a meat eater..humans have flat "molar" type teeth, designed to crush and maul nuts, berries, leafy greens....cat,lion,bear...you know..they have claws and sharp pointed teeth designed to rip and tear, they don't "chew" their food...but that's a different thread I do believe.

[macerico]

Well, other than my boss, I know maybe ONE other person.

The key in forming any colalition is to avoid attention. So, if someone is too vocal, they might bring unwanted attention to the group. Not that you can't oppose what's going on, but you have to keep it low key so most people don't care that you're speaking out.

Maybe that's a contradiction.

In either case, the point of an off-the-grid hideaway is so you have a place to go that people don't know to look for you there and will let you be.

As far as electrical storage goes....buy some TRUE deep-cycle marine batteries and wire them in parallel. Get a DC/AC inverter. I have a pdf that shows how to make a cheap power generator with a lawn edger and a car alternator. The same wiring setup would apply to solar or wind-generated power. In the end, you run off the batteries and recharge via the power source. Needless to say, you would learn to be VERY power conserving if not use electricity at all except for the creature comforts you definitely must have.

[weishaupt1776]

macerico, could you post that in the off grid living thread in the survival forum, por favor?

ICE, go to ffrugalsquirrels.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi

they are a 100% survival forum there

Also, I am proud of you, man. It takes alot of Brains and Balls to do what you are doing

[macerico]

Originally Posted by weishaupt1776

macerico, could you post that in the off grid living thread in the survival forum, por favor?

Oops. Sorry about derailing the thread. :(

[weishaupt1776]

I meant the pdf, sorry. It was intended just to get that document in that forum, no moderation intended

Originally Posted by Ice

If you folks are really interested in unplugging and living off the land... why not assist each other in reaching that goal?

Look, they have auctions of land that have been confiscated by the state for unpaid taxes and there have been some with a lot of acreage. It has to be bid on... but there is a way to go about this that could spawn an entire community on one huge parcel of land. . . . .

ICE,

I appreciate your way of life. You are most definitely an inspiration. Indiana and Kentucky have relatively low prop tax rates in comparison to other states except Alaska though. For many reasons it may not be possible for some to walk away from their location and unless they have a huge store of FRN's to continure to pay prop. tax it may not be possible to live as you do although the desire is there. Prop. Tax is a great way to keep people dependent upon the system because they have to stay in the system to make enough to pay the tax or be kicked out of their homes. All of us need air, water, food, shelter, and clothing to survive. These are vary basic necessities. Some on this forum believe we need governments, I will not attack their beliefs. It is not opinion though that we need the 5 things mentioned above to survive. For anyone no matter whether they call themselves government or space aliens, to lay claim to and or "TAX" those basic necessities is nothing short of a claim on the life that needs them to sustain continued existence. We have a word for this, it is called slavery!

I have 2 people personally known to me, who own their homes (No Mortgage) receive nothing from the state in terms of Aid, but due to medical issues cannot work jobs that give them the amount of income to pay "their Fair Share" (communist platitude) of property tax, so they are on the verge of being evicted and property sold. To purchase any property from governments that have been confiscated is to participate in theft, slave trade, and communism.

1. Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes. (AKA Property Tax)
2. A heavy progressive or graduated income tax. (No explanation needed)
3. Abolition of all right of inheritance. (Death Tax)
4. Confiscation of the property of emigrants and rebels (Confiscation for Unpaid Taxes)

These are the first 4 of 10 criteria that determine whether a society is practicing communism. All can be reasonably related to Property Tax. If anyone here disagrees then please help me to comprehend how anyone claiming rights/ownership to basic necessities of another not voluntarily traded or exchanged can be anything other than a claim upon the actual life and existence of the other. If you use the argument that we need to pay for roads, etc., I will agree. Gas Tax, Tax on car sales etc., but roads are not a basic necessity of life. Air, Food, Water, Shelter are!

[Ice]

Excise taxes pay for roads and all other things the government does here at home. Property tax is one reason to assert your rights in the land patent... which is why I brought up the land patent.

If folks that have been enjoying the "benefits" of their slavery fall into hard times -- isn't it their own undoing?

If the sheeple want to wake up then we can assist them as we do the members here at sui juris. But if I purchase property that some other has lost and then make it impossible for the government to lay any sort of claim against that property (forever) -- have I not done a greater service than the sheeple that have perpetuated the problems by being followers of their public servants instead of being their leaders??

Ice

[citizensoldier]

Originally Posted by Ice

[b][color=Blue]Excise taxes pay for roads and all other things the government does here at home. Property tax is one reason to assert your rights in the land patent... which is why I brought up the land patent.

Ice,

You may not realize, but a land patent doesn't have anything to do with property taxes. Property taxes are a result of the terms of a contractual agreement, namely the voter registration. When one registers as a voter, they are contractually obligating themselves to a democracy supporting a corp entity (local govt, schools, etc...). Under such a democracy, the majority vote decides the outcome, which all voters become obligated by the contract.
The only way for Corp US or any other entity to place an obligation on one's property is through contracts.

Ice, & citizensoldier



I agree, a sales tax on gasoline is an excise that supposedly pays for roads. The government is pretty much funded by excise. Read the Grace Commission Report. I have no problems paying for services that are wanted, and used. The problem is being forced to pay for services that are not wanted, used, nor is there any duty to provide. I guess I am still ignorant about how to secure property but am trying to learn.



My current understanding is with that of citizen soldier, and what Weis has posted about the 14th amendment in other threads, dealing with standing and status. Although Yick Wo v Hopkins may say otherwise, I still think there is a presumption with a mass of paperwork to back up the presumption. Bureaucrats kill you with millions of paper cuts.



It may or may not be true that land cannot be taken for taxes where some one has claimed and asserted their rights as documented via assign to an original patent; however, I don't personally know anyone who doesn't pay property tax other than the ones normally exempted like churches etc. I have never seen or talked to anyone face to face and have them lay out their evidence. Finding an original patent and asserting a claim as an assign is fairly simple just requires a little time and research in public records. Anyone can post here and say they have a patent and don't pay property taxes, I could say I don't pay either but I'd be a liar. I have been able to get it reduced a considerable amount but that is about it. I'm not from Missouri, but Show me anyway; I want to see someone's, anyone’s evidence; go to the county courthouse where the patent claim is filed and research the tax rolls; meet this man or woman and thank them for showing all of us how to live free.



I don't care whether I *own* property or not, all I want is to live on a spot of ground not beholden to another; plant a garden, feed the chickens, and rabbits, and demonstrate to others by example, and let the rest of the world go to hell if that is what the masses want. I don't care bout income taxes and the like, cause once you're not beholden to pay rent to someone else for simply living and tending a piece of land, then you don't need a "corporate" job, or bank accounts. I haven't seen the IRS or any local taxing body go after anyone that didn't have a sizeable income from a job, some money in the bank, or some home or property or other assets to steal.



The point is that if one can provide for their basic necessities and not pay some government for the privilege of simply existing, by tending a piece of land that provides basic needs, then the rest doesn't really matter. If one has no bank accounts, nor job, there is nothing for them to take except for your life, and I would make'em work hard for that!



Do you pay your local vipers?