Letter 2797

I have received three letters that say BOD: WI, CP:515

We need your assistance in updating our records.

Correct Yes, No

Sincerely,
Compliance Services Field Director

---

I have not filed for 12 years and during that time had 1 year where I sold something that generated > 100K. I have worked for 5-6 different companies during this period.

The nature of my excuse is I have been busy as heck and knew I needed to go back and fix this.

What I did not know until today is that going back to fix this wasn't going to be easy, that I am probably in some special status, and that not filing is a crime. I had no idea and now I am scared as hell. I can actually go to jail for not filing!?

Obviously, I am hiring an attorney tomorrow, but what does this letter mean?

Am I under a criminal investigation?

Is it likely I will face prosecution and jail??????????????

Also, I noticed someone warning about letters with all caps names, but couldn't find any information --- my name and address are all caps. What does that mean?

[JWR]

Since I'm not at home right now I'm just going from memory. But I do know the WI means "Wage/Investment" and the "CP515" is "First Notice, Delinquent Return." Also, ANY CP Notices above 99 are for businesses ONLY.


You might try doing a search over at Family Guardian on this.


JWR

[theghost]

Originally Posted by honestcitizen

I have received three letters that say BOD: WI, CP:515

We need your assistance in updating our records.

Correct Yes, No

Sincerely,
Compliance Services Field Director

---

I have not filed for 12 years and during that time had 1 year where I sold something that generated > 100K. I have worked for 5-6 different companies during this period.

The nature of my excuse is I have been busy as heck and knew I needed to go back and fix this.

What I did not know until today is that going back to fix this wasn't going to be easy, that I am probably in some special status, and that not filing is a crime. I had no idea and now I am scared as hell. I can actually go to jail for not filing!?

Obviously, I am hiring an attorney tomorrow, but what does this letter mean?

Am I under a criminal investigation?

Is it likely I will face prosecution and jail??????????????

Also, I noticed someone warning about letters with all caps names, but couldn't find any information --- my name and address are all caps. What does that mean?

honestcitizen,
you have about two years of hard study ahead of you before you should do anything. As to your question "Is it likely I will face prosecution and jail?',... if you hire this attorney tommorrow, most assuredly you will, you can absolutely count on it. I find it hard to believe that you haven't filed for 12 years, without knowing anything or thinking that nothing would ever happen to you. With all due respect, I smell a rat/plant here. I think you know more than you are letting on. Have you used banks to cash your checks in those 12 years? If so, you'd have heard from the IRS sooner. Sorry to sound so harsh, this just sounds incredible to me.
If I received a letter like you described, I might just write that compliance officer and let him know that I'd be happy to assist him in updating "their" records, but my services don't come cheap. Say $500.00 an hour, or use your imagination here. Also, if the form does not have an OMB number in the upper right hand corner, it is not authorized by congress for the collection of information from the citizen, and it can be ignored. Although, I never ignore anything from bureaucrats. I would have fun with it, as described above.

Originally Posted by theghost

honestcitizen,
you have about two years of hard study ahead of you before you should do anything. As to your question "Is it likely I will face prosecution and jail?',... if you hire this attorney tommorrow, most assuredly you will, you can absolutely count on it. I find it hard to believe that you haven't filed for 12 years, without knowing anything or thinking that nothing would ever happen to you. With all due respect, I smell a rat/plant here. I think you know more than you are letting on. Have you used banks to cash your checks in those 12 years? If so, you'd have heard from the IRS sooner. Sorry to sound so harsh, this just sounds incredible to me.
If I received a letter like you described, I might just write that compliance officer and let him know that I'd be happy to assist him in updating "their" records, but my services don't come cheap. Say $500.00 an hour, or use your imagination here. Also, if the form does not have an OMB number in the upper right hand corner, it is not authorized by congress for the collection of information from the citizen, and it can be ignored. Although, I never ignore anything from bureaucrats. I would have fun with it, as described above.

i'm not a plant/rat. i honestly have just been really busy moving/working and trying to get ahead. i thought i could simply go back and catch up on this paperwork and would have to pay stiff fines for any money i owed. of course i have used banks, but i moved quite a bit relative to jobs. i don't mean to sound so rediculously naive, but can't you just re-engage with agree of the penalties and pay up?

why would having an attorney file my back paperwork be a quick ticket to jail?

edit: would i not receive this letter if i am under a criminal investigation? meaning, is it possible for me to voluntarily comply stiff?

[Skeptic]

What I did not know until today is that going back to fix this wasn't going to be easy, that I am probably in some special status, and that not filing is a crime. I had no idea and now I am scared as hell. I can actually go to jail for not filing!?

Yes, you COULD go to jail, but this doesn't mean you WILL go to jail for sure. You need to contact a good tax attorney and tell him what happened, no matter how embarrassed you might feel about it.

Generally speaking, the IRS likes to have the possibility of criminal prosecution for tax evasion as a possibility, but if the taxpayer is showing that they wish to get on the IRS's "good side" by paying back taxes and filing returns for previous years, etc., they will probably not use this option. It also depends on how much money you owe: if you are a CEO that made $10,000,000 a year and didn't file, they would be a lot tougher, probably, than if you are an average Joe that had $35,000 a year and didn't file.

Of course I cannot give you legal advice about your specific situation, I'm just saying that jail is indeed a threat, it is but by no means a foregone conclusion. I can see you are scared and embarrased, but do not panic. Get legal advice and take it from there.

[theghost]

Originally Posted by honestcitizen

i'm not a plant/rat. i honestly have just been really busy moving/working and trying to get ahead. i thought i could simply go back and catch up on this paperwork and would have to pay stiff fines for any money i owed. of course i have used banks, but i moved quite a bit relative to jobs. i don't mean to sound so rediculously naive, but can't you just re-engage with agree of the penalties and pay up?

why would having an attorney file my back paperwork be a quick ticket to jail?

edit: would i not receive this letter if i am under a criminal investigation? meaning, is it possible for me to voluntarily comply stiff?

honestcitizen,
if it is your desire to just pay up and make nice nice with the IRS, then sure, you can do that. I'm sure there are a great many attorneys willing to take your money and contact and deal with the IRS on your behalf. You are probably looking at a paperwork nightmare though, as well as a great expense. I once sat with a "tax" attorney, (before I became educated) and simply asked him to take on my brothers "willful failure to file" case, he told me he wanted $10,000 up front, with no gaurantees! My remark about using the attorney and going to jail was referring to him defending you in a court action. You would most likely have to be made an example of, with that many years of not filing, especially if your trial happened to fall around spring time. You do not need an attorney to answer that form you received, it's a computerized mass mailed form. "I" would respond as I said in my previous post, but that's just me. Not to be construed with legal advice, of course.

[JWR]

During this time you weren't "filing", were you paying but just not filing? I know several people that pay in but don't file and are never bothered by the IRS because they pay in more that what they are claimed to owe.


Now if you were not paying AND not filing then it is amazing you are just now hearing from them. It usually doesn't take this long.

By theghost:
I find it hard to believe that you haven't filed for 12 years, without knowing anything or thinking that nothing would ever happen to you. With all due respect, I smell a rat/plant here. I think you know more than you are letting on. Have you used banks to cash your checks in those 12 years? If so, you'd have heard from the IRS sooner. Sorry to sound so harsh, this just sounds incredible to me.

Ditto on this. I also agree that you need to do some serious studying on this stuff before you make a move. You'll also find the more you learn the less fear you'll have.

As far as what Skeptic says, I must agree with him on one point, there is always a possibility you may go to jail, BUT (always a but) it all depends on your unique circumstances and how you handle it. That is something you'll have to decide for yourself.

But if you owe the tax, pay the tax.

JWR

[theghost]

honestcitizen, forgot to mention, you're probably not under investigation, yet, because they usually inform you when they begin an investigation, because they want you to start sweating early. Also, they (C.I.D.) will usually try to arrange a meeting with you soon after beginning one, because they need YOUR testimony to use as a basis for everything they do in court. Remember what the black supreme court justice said, (I forget his name) "everyone in prison is there because they opened their mouth", ....or something close to that.

Thanks for the comments.

I did generate 100,000 over and above my income that was paid to me over 2 years and plan to claim and pay taxes on that amount. The rest of the time, I was paying in through my exployer and probably do not owe much tax from year to year, but I could be wrong if they underpaid. Hopefully, I can get an installment plan since I will probably owe about 25K + penalties and interest on that amount.

I found a couple of things on the Internet, one is these letters are generated when previous attempts TDA/TDI result in returned mail. I guess what concerns me most is that I received multiple ones on the same day. Did an investigation just start?

So, it seems from the IRS website, a couple of comments here, and other information I have read that I have file my returns and make arrangements to pay the tax I will most likely avoid prosecution. I hope this is the case.

Originally Posted by JWR

During this time you weren't "filing", were you paying but just not filing? I know several people that pay in but don't file and are never bothered by the IRS because they pay in more that what they are claimed to owe.


Now if you were not paying AND not filing then it is amazing you are just now hearing from them. It usually doesn't take this long.

Ditto on this. I also agree that you need to do some serious studying on this stuff before you make a move. You'll also find the more you learn the less fear you'll have.

As far as what Skeptic says, I must agree with him on one point, there is always a possibility you may go to jail, BUT (always a but) it all depends on your unique circumstances and how you handle it. That is something you'll have to decide for yourself.

But if you owe the tax, pay the tax.

JWR

[Ecclesiastes]

Some suggestions/observations for honestcitizen:

1. Do NOT, under any circumstances, pay any attention to any of the other "advice" you have received (and will receive) in this forum, because the regular posters to this forum are crazy goofballs who have never won a case in court, and would be criminally prosecuted themselves if they weren't so economically and politically irrelevant.

2. Yes, get a lawyer, and follow your lawyer's advice. Ask your lawyer to hire an accountant to do your tax returns for you so that the information you give the lawyer is protected by attorney-client privilege. (There is no accountant-client privilege.)

3. Get your financial records together so that you and your lawyer can file returns as soon as possible, regardless of whether or not you can pay the tax. The letter you received does not look like a criminal investigation, just a form letter generated to find out why you haven't filed a tax return. Believe it or not, the IRS is more interested in compliance that prosecution (and criminal prosecutions are expensive), so the IRS rarely prosecutes if returns are filed before a criminal investigation begins.

4. You said you worked for different companies, but didn't say if you were an employee or a contractor. If you were an employee (and received W-2s), you may owe very little tax, because of withholdings. (In fact, you may find that by failing to file you have lost money that you could have gotten back in refunds.) If you were a contractor (and received 1099s), you may owe tax, penalties, and interest.

Good luck.