a peace officer may not detain or arrest a person for no license

[freebeme]

Originally Posted by Lawdog

And even a non-arrestable offense still gets you a citation.

Citations are release from arrest forms. Meaning you are already under arrest. Every single traffic stop for the purpose of enforcing any provision of law against the driver is a "formal awrrest" and not a detention in California.

Also, Lawdog, the officer cannot even "detain" me. So what the hell is he going to do when he calls a truck and I take off?

[Lawdog]

You're being detained or arrested for ANOTHER offense, like speeding or DUI, remember? That you can't be detained or arrested solely for not having a license isn't a shield against being detained or arrested for other offenses.

[freebeme]

Originally Posted by Lawdog

You're being detained or arrested for ANOTHER offense, like speeding or DUI, remember? That you can't be detained or arrested solely for not having a license isn't a shield against being detained or arrested for other offenses.

So? Is the title of this thread "One cannot be arrested for anything?" No it is not.

However "speeding" is not a "public offense" in California. So no arrest should be allowed for that either.

Not to mention that a public offense is simply not having a license to do what is being done. Natural persons are not under the jurisdiction of "public offenses". However that is for another time and another thread.

Again, you said no one is ever pulled over for not having a license... Is a license plate a license? (Are you avoiding answering while you scurry to look it up... You law dog, you)

Also, is a "registration tab/sticker" a "license"?

[Lawdog]

(e) Notwithstanding Section 40300 or any other provision of law, a peace officer may not detain or arrest a person solely on the belief that the person is an unlicensed driver, unless the officer has reasonable cause to believe the person driving is under the age of 16 years.
(f) The inability to obtain a driver's license pursuant to this
section does not abrogate or diminish in any respect the legal
requirement of every driver in this state to obey the motor vehicle
laws of this state, including laws with respect to licensing, motor
vehicle registration, and financial responsibility.

The statute clearly refers to lack of a driver's license not being an arrestable offense. Only a terminally obtuse person would think I was talking about a vehicle plate instead of a driver's license.

A license plate is evidence that the vehicle is properly registered. It's a totally separate matter. A vehicle could be 100% legal and the driver unlicensed, or the driver could have a license but the tag might be invalid.

Has anyone ever been stopped for having an invalid vehicle tag? You bet. That has happened to several of your nutball buddies. Driving around with a homemade tag that says "John Smith, Sovereign Citizen" or some other nonsense is practically begging to be pulled over by the cops.

[FreeFromContract]

Originally Posted by Lawdog

And the statute doesn't say they can't tow your car. So maybe you won't be arrested, but you'll be walking home.

The statute doesn't say a wide variety of things. What it does state is the legislature's intent. So unless a statute explicitly grants the authority to tow the car under certain circumstances, it's not getting towed (and in this instance, it does not).

[Lawdog]

Think again. Just because you can't be arrested doesn't mean the car can't be impounded. From the California Vehicle Code:

14607.6. (a) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, and except as provided in this section, a motor vehicle is subject to forfeiture as a nuisance if it is driven on a highway in this state by a driver with a suspended or revoked license, or by an unlicensed driver, who is a registered owner of the vehicle at the time of impoundment and has a previous misdemeanor conviction for a violation of subdivision (a) of Section 12500 or Section 14601, 14601.1, 14601.2, 14601.3, 14601.4, or 14601.5.

(b) A peace officer shall not stop a vehicle for the sole reason of determining whether the driver is properly licensed.

(c) (1) If a driver is unable to produce a valid driver's license on the demand of a peace officer enforcing the provisions of this code, as required by subdivision (b) of Section 12951, the vehicle shall be impounded regardless of ownership, unless the peace officer is reasonably able, by other means, to verify that the driver is properly licensed. Prior to impounding a vehicle, a peace officer shall attempt to verify the license status of a driver who claims to be properly licensed but is unable to produce the license on demand of the peace officer.

"Shall" is a word of command. This means the officer is duty bound to impound the vehicle and may not exercise discretion in the matter.

Also, check this out, from the California Highway Patrol's website, http://www.chp.ca.gov/html/impound.html:

Both 14602.6 and 14607.6 of the CVC give law enforcement officers the authority to impound your vehicle when it is being operated by an "unlicensed driver" (license not issued, suspended or revoked).

Your car is being impounded because you have committed a misdemeanor, not an infraction. By operating a motor vehicle without a valid driver's license you have committed a serious offense. In addition to the citation, the vehicle you are operating will be impounded and held for 30 days, or possibly forfeited.

"Will be." Not "might be."

So if you plan to go driving in California without a valid driver's license, wear comfortable shoes, 'cause you might be walking home.

[freebeme]

Originally Posted by Lawdog

Think again. Just because you can't be arrested doesn't mean the car can't be impounded. From the California Vehicle Code:

Under what authority of law is he going to make me leave the car in the first place and under what authority of law is he going to use to prevent me from simply driving away.

Also I see that he may not even stop me for failure to have a license.

Again and again, Lawdog, can you tell me if a license plate and a registration sticker are, in fact, licenses?

[moishanb]

Let us peel the onion back, if you will:

1) What is a peace officer
2) What is driving?
3) When does the authority of a peace officer apply to me?
4) What is a motor vehicle?
5) When does the motor vehicle code apply to me?
6) When does the motor vehicle code not apply to me?
7) What are the exemptions to the code?
8) Is there lawful excuse to do or not to do something within the code?

This is just a hand full of questions I just thougtht about, and could spend hours coming up with more. I would say that we(society in america) are experts at presuming things. Let's call this certain class of people PRESUMPTORS. Once we stop presuming things, we need to start asking questions(I know, this goes totally against public education).

Once again, from early on in the posting, FIRST THINGS FIRST!!!!! I say what I mean, not the other way around. Remember Humpty Dumpty?

Here is the most important thing to remember from all of these posts:

PERCEPTION leads to BELIEF, which leads to AGREEMENT, which leads to CONTRACT, which leads to BREACH OF CONTRACT, which leads to BREACH OF TRUST, which leads to a PENALTY.

Also, "if I aint buyin what your sellin, then I aint payin what your chargin"

[farmer_giles_of_ham]

That CHP website looks like from the old "Fat Albert Show". I could just hear the ghetto in the background. Complete with loudmouth lawyer and his federal plantation citizens...


http://www.chp.ca.gov/html/impound.html

"you gots to pay yo fine, sugar!"




I also like the surprised 'gang-banger'- what is he drinking?



What our local loudmouth




conveniently "forgot" is that the whole section in question:

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cacode...950-12954.html

only applies to existing holders of CA driver licenses. AKA "residents"

as required by subdivision (b) of Section 12951

what will charlie do about this one?

An unlicensed driver is a potential danger to all other motorists on the highway. He / she may not know the rules of the road or practice safe driving techniques. A driver who is unlicensed, or has a suspended or revoked driver's license has been ordered not to drive because of previous driving violations. Continuing to drive shows a flagrant disregard for the safety of other motorists.

Ok sanctimonious windbag:


http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cacode...500-12527.html

12503. A nonresident over the age of 18 years whose home state or country does not require the licensing of drivers may operate a foreign vehicle owned by him for not to exceed 30 days without obtaining a license under this code.

The whole thing makes my skin crawl.

[moishanb]

Originally Posted by farmer_giles_of_ham

That CHP website looks like from the old "Fat Albert Show". I could just hear the ghetto in the background. Complete with loudmouth lawyer and his federal plantation citizens...
.

You are going to make me lazy with all of your facts!

Thanks for the major premises!!!!