Traffic Court Losses

[weishaupt1776]

Wow, this looks insane. - In a good way Thanks.

[squirrel]

Here's some more goood stuff.

http://commonlawvenue.com/People/RMc...nual_Index.htm

[kmcarr]

Hello all,
I have been a member here for about a month and have been learning a lot. To Quickly get to the point, on May 27th 2005 I was pulled over in a Large city Park here in Saint Louis Missouri and Written two tickets. The traffic stop started with an impeding the flow of traffic charge and also resulted in a failure to show proof of insurance ticket. I sat quietly in the Jeep while the officer wrote the tickets and when it came time to sign I signed my name and under it wrote “all rights reserved UCC-207”. I don’t know why I wrote it but I thought just in case. The officer took my licence as bond and I was then free to go. A week later I lost my wallet and the tickets that I was using as my identification. This turned out to be a good thing because I had to learn how to operate in everyday life without something I took for granted every day. I checked the internet for legal opinions about my traffic case and found ticket slayer through the sui juris website. I ordered the documents from there on the 13th of June and received them on the 16th. I guess they were really busy because no info was entered on them for me. That was fine because it was another learning experience for me. On June 6th I went to the City Traffic Court Clerk’s office to see if I could get a copy of the tickets. I knew the court date and courtroom #, July 7th #4 at 2PM, but didn’t have the case or ticket numbers to put on the TS docs. While there the clerk asked if I wanted to bond out my Operators Liscense and I said no. He asked how I was driving and I said I wasn’t and I didn’t need my Op. Lic. Back. He said the copies of the tickets were 2 dollars each and I realized that they were not the original tickets so I just asked him for the ticket numbers. I got the numbers and left.
June 17th and 18th was spent entering the info into the TS Docs and I got them ready to file. I couldn’t find local rules for how long the Pro. Atty. Should get before there was a default on the AoT and I got no help from the PA’s Office ( Here in Saint Louis we have a City Counsler btw). I decided that 10 business days was the best I could do with 3 day notice to cure ending on the 4th of July. I know I was cutting it close. I expected my filing times to be an issue in court. AoT and NoD with 3 day cure were filed on June 20th. From the 20th of June to the 5th of July I read everything I could on the internet. The Traffic losses threads had lots of great info for me and it was helpful to see the treads specific to not only the Common Law defaults process but TS as well. Ont the 5th of July I filed the FNoD the MtD and the Writ of Praecipe. Because court arrainment was the 7th of July I didn’t file the Writ of Mandamus. I wanted to give the three days like the Writ of Praecipe says I would. I know there are only two issues before the Judge when I walk into court under special appearance 1 Rule on Motions to dismiss and 2 Rule on Petition for Writ of Mandamus, but I didn’t want to appear like I was pushing the dates. I knew before I walked into court I had made 2 big mistakes and probably a third by not filing the WoM. The first mistake was in my hurry to file the AoT and NoD I only put one ticket or case number on the docs. I had 2 separate tickets. The other was I put THE STATE OF MISSOURI as the plantiff. When I went to deliver the PA his copy of the AoT and NoD the intern (the clerk or secretary wouldn’t take them) said “we aren’t the state of Missouri” and I said that’s OK just initial and Date my copies. So on the next set of docs I made the same mistakes. July 7th I go to court and It was one of those cash register courts where the judges comes in and sets right next to the clerk with the cash register. The judge didn’t even have a tie. A funny thing happened while I was there. A women, a lawyer I presumed is sitting on the defendants table and she stands up says hello judge I just wanted to introduce Dave a new intern in our office and I have a personal matter I need you to take care of for me. She hands the Judge a ticket he writes on it and she gives it top the clerk and walks out. I am setting there like what is this crap!
So after about 5 minutes my name is called and I begin to cross the bar. I introduce my self as Xxxxx Xxxxx Xxxxx upper and lower case letters. The Judge looks at me and says do you have insurance?

Me- Judge have you read my papers
J-You Have Papers?
Me- Yes and I hand him my copies
J –He looks at them for 4 seconds and says Get Dave or John in here.

So I take a couple of steps back and sit on the defendants table like I owned the damn thing and waited. The Judge kept reading the docs and after about 3 minutes says Ill get back with you in a minute. The City Marshals Deputy says to me Sir have a seat on the bench and I said excuse me. He repeated and I said I will have a seat over here and I went and sat down back in the audience with my wife. After about 10 minutes every one else, there were only 3, was usherd through and the the PA comes through the door. Judge says John Mr Xxxx here filled some things with your office and I guess you didn’t get it. John takes a look at the docs and I mean a glance and says I get these all the time and they all say the same thing I dismiss it all or I object to it all of it. The judge then proceds to tell me how I say some pretty strong things in my docs about him being dishonest and dishonorable and part of a conspiracy. He says I worked really hard to get my robe (which he wasn’t even wearing, the guy had on a button up shirt and kakis…no tie even) and I don’t like these things being said about my court. I am thinking at this time it doesn’t say any thing like that. Things become a blur after that. Another guy comes in and starts to go through my paperwork mumbling things like I don’t see any problem with the name and just the address is different and other things I didn’t pay attention to. I just remember thinking who is this guy? I mean I see the judge the clerk the marshal and the City Counsler (I guess it was him) but who is this unidentified guy? The Judge continues to talk to me about frivolous petitions and the fines and jail time I can get for that (180days and 1000$) oh sure I remember that part great. The Marshal comes over and stands 2 feet behind me and now I realize Crap Here I go I’m being intimidated…Ive lost initative… there is so much going on around me I cant concentrate on the process in front of me. I had taken note for just this occasion but this came too fast. All I managed to get out was the PA has defaulted, lost all power to proscute and I want you to do your duty and order a certificate of Default. I told him I would believe this court being honorable when I saw him do his duty. He advised me to get council and said I am entering a plea of not guilty. I said I object there is still a matter of Juristiction… You haven’t completed Subject Matter Jurisdiction. He said you can object all you want to but if you come to trial like this you will be treated as an attorney in regards to punishments under rule 37 and will be subject to the rules and procedures of the Supreme court of Missouri. Then some clerk talk about when to schedule trial. Trial set for 8-24 4 at 1. I guess that’s the date and the room # and time. The marshal gave me a slip with the times and such before I left. The whole ordeal was so informal and frustrating. I didn’t know who to object to who was addressing me I just stood there and let em steam roll me. I know I new what to say I just never felt I got the chance to address any thing with them. I felt I could defend my position if given the opportunity or maybe I showed up to a gun fight with a stick. Here are some odd things, to me, that occurred during the arraignment. At one point while the judge was trying to find the PA he was calling people on his cell phone looking for the PA and I one point I heard him mention the City Marshals name. While he was on the phone he leaves the bench and walks out of the court room. I don’t know if that has some significance or not. Did I change courts when he walked out or something else I am supposed to know. The whole ordeal after the PA came in and started to speak just felt like a show or something scripted. I mean I know these guys work together everyday and can get used to treating each other like co workers but where is the professionalism when conducting business? They really just wanted to brow beat me back into submission and get me out of there. The Sad Part is, after they started talking over me, I let them push me around and wanted to get out of there. I want to keep things on paper and minimize my court room exposure. continued...

[kmcarr]

Towards the end, while the judge was telling me about frivlous paperwork he looks out into the audience, directly at my wife and begins to talk at her. He says I can order you up on a psyce evaluation and blah blah blah and then says my name is Joe Murphy directly to her. I don’t know if that was some kind of mafia crap like and we know who you are too or what but that was odd as well. The last thing I said to the Judge was I will be filing a writ of Mandamus on Monday Respectfully ordering you to order the Court Clerk to File the Certificate of Default. The clerks eyes got as big as saucers when I said that, like she couldn’t believe I was still speaking to the judge that way. OK before I ask for help or opinions I will go over the mistakes I know I made.1 Not keeping total control of the situation. 2 not getting everyones name and what they were there for, especially the little guy that kept mumbling to me. 3 Not keeping my mouth shut. I felt that I knew what to expect and what not to say. I wasn’t going to argue facts. I wasn’t going to PLAY lawyer. I felt as though I should be reasonable and explain my paperwork. Damit I shouldn’t have to, they know the law, all I did was let them know I couldn’t keep up with them.4 I didn’t keep a good record of the proceeding. My wife was there to take notes but she couldn’t write verbatim what was said or who said it and in her defense she wouldn’t know what I would need taken note of. I sat up in bed that night and said do you remember exactly what the PA said when he came in. Did he say I dismiss it all of it or did he say I object to it and the judge say what part and he say all of it. That is really important stuff for me not to remember exactly. Was I given cues I missed. The guy before me had a DUI and when the judge clearly said dismissed to him and he moved over to the clerk the bailiff/ marshal said your free to go but he didn’t address anyone. He just sat in the chair looking down and said your free to go and then said it again louder. I almost got up and walked out right then. It’s the little tricks I was looking for that I couldn’t pick up on or didn’t understand. I wanted to say to the Judge I don’t understand these things, I comprehend my documents but I don’t understand what is going on here like Weis said in his posts. I wanted to leave clues and hints for them but couldn’t work them in. I wanted to let the judge know I know how to file a Writ of Mandamus and I know what it means but couldn’t until the end when it just didn’t fit with the flow of the proceeding. I felt like and idiot telling the judge well you just set that trial Im filing a WoM and theres nothing you can do about it. Push me man I push back. Do your job dude or Ill make you. 5 the motions to dismiss were exactly as written by TS. I couldn’t back up the MtD with anything specific MO case law cites, rules, regs anything. I know I wasn’t going to even speak about the facts of my traffic stop I wasn t there for that. I thought the MtD were just there to give the Judge a way out. Hey judge just pick one and dismiss the case. 6 when the Judge entered a plea for me and I objected I should have strongly objected and then had it certified buy another Judge but at that time I knew I had lost the inniatve and was just trying to muster an orderly retreat from the field so I could fight another day.My next move is the trial on August 24th but I have no clue what to do there. I am really banking on the appeal I just dont want to have to wait for it from a cell. I can get the judge changed in the next 10days but I don’t know the pros or cons to doing that. Does that give me two judges to go after or just strengthen their case? Do I even show up to trial, kind of like my business is taken care of the PA defaulted why do I need anything else from the court. Not the brightest option I think but what if they do file the defaults and cover there butts without telling me. I show up to trial and they say, oh Mr Xxxxx you’re here good you have consented to our jurisdiction and we want our money now GUILTY. The only thing I know I have going for me is that I do have Insurance and was covered at the time of the stop I just hadn’t received the card yet and how bad can an impeding the flow of traffic fine be? This whole thing could have ended on the 7th by me just showing the judge the card. HA. Well the joke could end up on me but I’ll keep at this until I learn enough to make it work. Maybe I need acting classes. Maybe I should have horns announce my entrance to the court with a crier telling everyone he comes now he comes now. I know that’s insane. I know that if I want to be treated as Soverign I better need to earn it and learn how to be it. Perhaps that’s the root of what happened in court that day. If I want have it I have to take it (be Soverign) not just make them think I am. Its just a lot of pushing guys who have more guns than I do. The movie the Aviator had an interesting dialogue. Howard went to meet with the Senator who was raking him through hearings and the Senator says something like “Howard, the US Government just beat Germany, Italy and Japan who do you think you are?” So in conclusion any ideas or opinions from the good folks out there who want another pen in this sword fight for our Country, and Our Rights would be greatly appreacated.

Straight unaltered TS AoT and Nod w/3day cure filed on 6-20
Straight unaltered MtD, NoFD, and WoP filed (poorly)7-5
WoM to be filed 7-11
Trial set for 8-24
Help or more explaination of motions to dismiss
Insight into Court proceedings (I know it is hard with my incomplete explanations)
What to do/say not do/say at trial 8-24
Change judges?
Help with these rules
5.13 answer required-default Missouri Supreme Court
http://www.courts.mo.gov/courts/Cler...6?OpenDocument
37.51 Pleadings and motions before trial Missouri Supreme Court
http://www.courts.mo.gov/courts/Cler...2?OpenDocument



What does this mean? Is the county trying to claim soverignity? Does this relate at all?
SC85740
State ex rel. St. Louis County, Missouri, Janice Hammonds and Norris Acker v. The Honorable David Lee Vincent, III, Judge, Circuit Court of St. Louis County, Missouri
St. Louis County
Sovereign immunity in case against county and county officials
http://www.courts.mo.gov/__862565ec0...ht=2,frivolous

[weishaupt1776]

Don't beat yourself up.

There are attorneys who don't have the balls to challenge traffic tickets in this way. Of course they have the money & connections, but they are in fear of disbarment if they really stood up to the fraud.

Did you go to the success stories under OAS win?

Akira shredded !

[Livefire]

Weishaupt said a golden nugget there, Your link with the rule 37 applies to RESPONDENTS answering petitions made in the State SC....In that scenario, THE PROSECUTOR has to answer your paperwork or risk being disbarred!

Secondly I would demand the court take judicial notice of Haines V Kerner which basically states that the court MUST look to the SUBSTANCE of your pleadings and NOT THE FORM. This decision also states it is the courts responsibility to correct your pleadings. This judge is trying to intimidate you to submitting to an attorney. Haines v Kerner is a US Supreme Court decision and has to be honored by all inferior courts.

Besides....the punishment I see stated in rule 37 is disbarment....since when did you have a bar card!?

I'd also research and see if the court or the judges retirement fund is inured by the fines collected. This is the case in MI and if this is so in MO, ya might wanna petition for removal to a federal venue since the judge has a personal interest in the proceedings. That would probably cheese off the judge good and proper.

[kmcarr]

Thanks for the USC cite Livefire. I had read that early on in my research and was going crazy trying to remember where I had read substance vs form. UPDATE.
I filed the Writ of Mandamus today and during my very short conversation with the clerk she mentions that I have a warrent out for my arrest for failure to appear! I figured that she would try to stall me or something but she just stamped the writ and handed back to me. I jetted out of there real quick because I couldnt be late for work. So what gives, is this harrasment or what. Did the judge file the warrant because of a special appearance. They certainly treated me like I was there. Did I leave too early before he got to the other ticket. I just presumed they were together in the same case. Do I go down tommorrw and post a bond to keep from getting arrested when it is most inconvient for me or is there some other petition action I can take. This is really snowballing. After reading Akiras OAS Win Post again I was like cool, now all I have to do is wait for dismissal papers in the mail. Now maybe not.

[Livefire]

Just my humble opinion....the idiot probably issued the warrant for contempt of court. You might want to have a friend go check it out and find out what the charge is. Posting bond will probably cause you to traverse and subject yourself to the jurisdiction of the court. The TS approach is a common law approach and doesnt need all the statutory trappings. The only issue before the court is to rule on the writ....The facts are irrelavent since the prosecutor has defaulted and it is res judicata. Ya got yer work cut out for you. Best of Luck

Has anyone heard from mr carr?

[kmcarr]

I havent posted because I havent had anything positive to post. Yea I Punked out. An orderly retreat from the field was ordered. I filed the Mandamus on the following Monday and then waited until about a week before the trial to go hire a bar card holder. I was getting harassed, I think, but I could just be paranoia. I have lived in the City for 3 years with no crime problems whatsoever and then 1 week after I went before the Judge my wife’s car got broken into and someone attempted to steal it. The only thing that leads me to suspect municipal involvement is that was the car I was driving at the time so that’s the plate number they had. So after 2 weeks in the shop getting the steering column repaired we get it back and not 8 hours later some kid in a beat up old minivan side swipes the car while it is out on the street. I ran outside and caught the kids who were driving and held them until the cops got there. Of course no one in the car had an ID or insurance. The cop took down their information and then let them go. After all that the conspiracy nut in me came out, and the constant “advice” of my other half, and so I caved and paid the goons their cash. Dealing with “my” attorney was fun though. He kept telling me how I had to be there for the trial and the Judge really was going to expect me to be there. I told him that’s what I’m paying him for, Now Go and REPRESENT me. I’m not giving up though. I still have the TS docs and now I know a hell of a lot more on how to use them and handle myself in front of the black robed lawyer. Next time I will be ready to file everything on time and in order so I will have a lot more confidence in my strategy. Marc Stevens book was a good read but wasn’t very helpful-to me. He basically says try and avoid the bureaucratic **9%#$ if you can, but if you cant these are some of my experiences. I still encourage everyone to read it. So until my next engagement I’ll be reading and learning along with everyone else here. Thanks for the interest Mr. Nuetron.