Passports - American Nationals

KaosTheory · #1 11-05-2004, 11:45 AM

Ok, today I went and handed in my application (FamGuardian amended for American Nationals) for a passport. I filled it out and put 0's in where the SSN was suppose to be since only U.S. Citizens are required to have an SSN. Well of course the clerk tried to convince me that I was a U.S. Citizen because I had a birth certificate. I informed him that being a citizen in the geographical area called Maryland did not qualify one for U.S. Citizenship and showed him the code that said that.

Page 3 at the bottom here:

http://famguardian.org/TaxFreedom/Ev...eptOfState.pdf

He was puzzled but went on. He wanted a driver license. I told him that I didn't have it with me. He asked how I got there. I said a friend. Now I'm not sure if the driver licence would mean anything as far as U.S. Citizenship so I just offered a picture I.D. from work which he didn't want to accept because he wasn't familiar with me. He said that his book said that he had to be familiar with me in order to accept it. I said well what is the purpose of the birth certificate? He thought about it and finally said "Well I don't think they are going to accept it but I'll file this anyway". He asked "So you don't have a SSN" I asked "Do you"? He said "Yes, I got it at birth. Everyone has an SSN". I said "Well I can tell you that I do not have an SSN". He said "So you work here and you don't have an SSN". I said "Yep". He shook his head and said "I'm not going to argue with you. The IRS will fine you $500 for not giving an SSN" I asked for a copy of the app and said no. It is STATE property now. I just said ok basically and that was it.

I ask to have it expedited which should only take 2 weeks. I'll keep you all posted as to the results.

KT

Raptor13x · #2 11-27-2004, 04:46 PM

Birth Certificates are adhesion contracts for US citizens only. As far as I know, the safest thing to do is record births in the family Bible. Only US citizens can have drivers licenses, so you shouldnt have one. A positive ID you make yourself should be enough. Basically under the penalty of perjury, I am who I say I am here.

KaosTheory · #3 11-27-2004, 05:28 PM

What are the necessary elements of a valid contract? How can someone consent to a contract in your place? It isn't a contract. Do you think that it would be entered as evidence in a court? Read up on contracts here:

http://www.mind-trek.com/reports/cona.htm

It's been 3 weeks since I applied for the passport which was suppose to be expedited. So far, nothing.

Raptor13x · #4 11-29-2004, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaosTheory

What are the necessary elements of a valid contract? How can you someone consent to a contract in your place? It isn't a contract. Do you think that it would be entered as evidence in a court? Read up on contracts here:

A contract is only valid if both parties entered into it knowingly and willingly, which makes all the contracts most people have signed with the government fraudulent. They didnt tell you the details, you may have been willing at the time, but you had no clue of the implications or the option not to apply, and nobody involved even came close to explaining it to you. They are also highly suspicious because the terms of the contracts are so incredibly beneficial to one party(the government) while subjecting the other party (you) to hundreds of thousands if not millions of rules and regulations, for virtually no benefit to you.

On any contract, if you can prove you entered into the contract without knowing what it was about, especially if you were coerced into doing so, its null and void.

KaosTheory · #5 12-06-2004, 05:46 AM

Ok, I finally called to see what was taking so long with the passport (1 month later) and basically they say that if you are born in a "STATE" you are a US Citizen. The only people who are American Nationals are born in Guam or American Samoa. Next, if you do not enter a SS# then your application will not be processed.

Oh well, I didn't care to get a passport anyway. Who would want to leave this wonderful country.

End of story.

TheBlackTruth · #6 12-06-2004, 06:47 AM

I was told to simply put a line through the SSN field and write "Religious Objector" next to it and it will be processed just fine.

-BT

KaosTheory · #7 12-12-2004, 10:37 AM

Well the form just says that it is voluntarty and to fill in with zero's if you don't have one. I just filled in with zero's per instructions. So I can't see what the problem is.

I'm thinking that the "National" entry is the real problem.

KT

Jerseee · #8 12-12-2004, 02:23 PM

If you read the passport itself you will see that it gives you an option "citizen/national".

KaosTheory · #9 12-13-2004, 02:54 AM

Jersee,

Not sure if you read my initial post or not.

I downloaded the form from Family Guardian that replaces "US Citizen" with the word "National" and I put the check in that box.

I filled in zero's for the SS#.

I paid the extra fee to have it expedited.

I have not gotten so much as a "Sorry we don't serve your kind here" letter.

I called to see what was taking so long.

The lady on the phone said that if I submitted a "STATE" birth certificate then I am not a National but a US Citizen. I'd rather be the Easter Bunny....heh heh....She said if you don't enter the SS# then they won't process the app.

KT

#10 12-20-2004, 03:41 PM

Couple of questions:
What about the idea I have read about of using the regular passport application but changing U.S. to U.S.A. and citizen to Citizen?
Also,
I live in another country now, where my daughter was born. Any ideas about here application, which we need to be doing one of these days? Could she qualify as a U.S. national, or what?
I got mine when I was still a "citizen" and never saw the point in trying to change it. It's true what the post above says, the passport says something like "this U.S. citizen or national..." so I'll just cover the part that says "citizen".