Driver license and registration please?

[SansRecours]

I am going to ask questions and hopefully receive some answers that will be of practical benefit all. In qualifying myself in relation to the thread title, I will say (and 'tis true) that I do not, nor did I ever receive a thing commonly known as a driver license, or a registration (although I am constantly behind the wheel of cars, some do, and some don't have registrations).


So one is going down the road, siren and lights come on. One then pulls off to the side of the road (or better, onto private property, like a parking lot).
The police officer strolls up to the window and says; "License and registration please."

What do you say in response?

[rodman652]

Can a drivers license and registration be used against me in a court of law?..
Answer - Yes!

Then I assert my costitutionally protected God given right to not testify or incriminate against myself and remain secure in my person, places and effects as demanded in your 4th and 5th amendments that you as a government employee have taken a solemn oath to uphold, defend and protect.

I am well aware of the fact that driving is a privilege granted by government as we the people have given congress the legislative authority to regulate commerce and a driver is a person that operates a motor vehicle for hire and a vehicle in and of itself is a vessel used in commerce.

Although, I sometimes drive I am currently only travelling in an automobile.

If you are claiming your authority by statute or an ordinance which is administrative I hereby declare that I am not a party to the administration to which your authority applies!

Should you choose to violate your oath of office by depriving me of my life, liberty, or property without due process of law then you may be found in contempt, exposing yourself to being personally liable for your actions which may impose fines, prison time, and loss of your assets, while forbidding all future employment in the public/government sector for life.

Now, am I under arrest or am I free to go?

SIDE NOTE: All confrontations have ther own circumstances. This is a general response in an ideal way. while I have expressed the pertinent info in somewhat shallow detail one needs to proceed in a diplomatic and sincere manner as there are several personality types that can be encountered. I find that most officers are only doing the job they have been trained to do.
DO NOT MAKE IT PERSONAL! If you know what I mean.

[Livefire]

Yeah, otherwise he/she will PERSONALLY beat the crap outta ya then haul you off to jail! LOL

[gatorguy3]

I know that is only an example...though, in the spirit of not being able to regurgitate that insane little speech, what (in short) can someone say? I mean, many officers of the law do not (and are not capable of) knowing the actual law. They only know what they are taught; as was stated earlier.

[PANICPASS]

No matter what you say to the cop he is going to want to get information about the car from the plates. He will call it in to the DMV, or wherever.
The plates are going to tell the whole story. If you haven't taken care of cancelling your driver's license, the registration and plates then you can reasonably predict the cop will either tow it and ticket you. You will have to give him some sort of ID if you don't have a DL.

Preparation is the key to stopping the cop from doing anything.

[Judge Roy Bean]

Originally Posted by SansRecours

I am going to ask questions and hopefully receive some answers that will be of practical benefit all. In qualifying myself in relation to the thread title, I will say (and 'tis true) that I do not, nor did I ever receive a thing commonly known as a driver license, or a registration (although I am constantly behind the wheel of cars, some do, and some don't have registrations).


So one is going down the road, siren and lights come on. One then pulls off to the side of the road (or better, onto private property, like a parking lot).
The police officer strolls up to the window and says; "License and registration please."

What do you say in response?

How about likely scenario 1:

"Hi! You need to see my insurance, too, officer? Sorry, I, ah, don't have a license, and ah, the car isn't registered, see the plates are phony, too and so they wouldn't insure it so I don't have that either. You want me to get out of the car now?"

So they have you on several counts and they aren't going to send you off onto the road. In some states and municipalities now, not having insurance will get your car impounded, so you'll either be arrested (how do they know the car is even yours?) or you'll be on foot.

Scenario 2:

"See, officer, I was reading this stuff on the 'net, you know, about whether or not I"m really even, well, you know, subject to the law. Did you know about that, that commerce thing where I'm not operating the vehicle in commerce and so you know about your oath of office...."

So the officer again asks you for your license and registration and evidence of insurance, and when you babble on or give him that blank, confused stare, he talks into his radio for a few seconds and then asks you to step out of the car and asks you questions about if you've been drinking or using any drugs or have taken any medications. While waiting for the tow truck he sets you up for a field sobriety test while waiting for a supervisor to decide if you go to the jail or the local hospital for a psych eval first.

Either way, you're in jail or on foot. The car will be hauled off. And they charge daily impound fees.

Now of course, there's always the chance that our perp has been through this before and the local constabulary already know him pretty well. Repeat offenders are often colorful characters. In that case, the scenario is a bit shorter:

"Hi, Frank. Kinda late isn't it? No, still no damn license or b___s___ paperwork. Damn, you must not be busy. How's your sister's kid? That's good. Nope, I'll call my brother in law this time. No, haven't been to trial on that one yet. That first one they stuck me for twelve-hundred before it was all done. Awww, come on Frank. You really have to take me in again? It's not like I can go anywhere, Frank. Can we stop for coffee this time - that stuff you call coffee in the jail is boiled out owl____ and you know Frank, when Dale's boy towed the car last time he bent up the bumper, so don't....

[rodman652]

All u.s. citizens are required to identify themselves upon the request of a peace officer or they may face arrest for delaying an investigation or obstruction of justice. This recent ruling by the u.s. supreme court clearly states that paper work is not necessary and you can identify yourself verbally and this applies to U.S. citizens...before they can identify me as a U.S. citizen (which their paper work clearly states...which is fraudulent) they must surely recognize that I am a man...as in all men are created equal. I am first soveriegn!

18 USCC SECTION 242: WHOEVER UNDER COLOR OF LAW, STATUTE, ORDINANCE, REGULATION, OR CUSTOM WILLFULLY SUBJECTS ANY INHABITANT OF ANY STATE... TO THE DEPRIVATION OF ANY RIGHTS, PRIVILEGES OR IMMUNITIES SECURED OR PROTECTED BY THE CONSTITUTION OR LAWS OF THE UNITED STATES...SHALL BE FINED NOT MORE THAN $10,000 OR IMPRISONED NOT MORE THAN 10 YEARS, OR BOTH, AND IF DEATH RESULTS THEY SHALL BE SUBJECT TO IMPRISONMENT FOR ANY TERM...

[Akira]

As always, choose your battles wisely....

I recommend purchasing a few $50 - $200 junkers... so if/when they tow the car, the impound yard can keep it.

For HIS Glory,
Akira

[SansRecours]

I will always say "I do not have one?"

99% of the time (I'm not quite ready to talk about the time I tavelling in an 81 bright red Firebird with my own plate/message REPENT) I am in a car with a registration and a plate on it.

"What do you mean, you don't have one?"
"That's right officer, I do not have one."
"Do you mean to say it's suspended"
"No sir, I have never had a driver license." (this here is the truth)

Now, I am going somewhere with this, and it will develop slowly, but my aim is to make people aware of their surroundings on a traffic stop, so that the sharing of my experiences can have a tangible reality. Where I am going with this gets to the very nature of what really is a traffic ticket, what really is a driver license, and exactly WHAT (at least the statutory presumptions) it is that you purport to be. Who you are matters not.

What is the next thing after this brief conversation that the police officer will ALWAYS do? (I say always because I witness that he does this every time, unless one produces a license.) It is important and it happens before going to the radio.

The next thing I want people to know, is the nature of the officer's training-
That officer is always a product of training and policy. He is trained that, as an officer he is that "thin blue line" between order and chaos. He is trained also to ALWAYS be in control. If you get agressive, so will he. If you wish to run, he will pursue. He is a trained killer armed with deadly ordnance and dangerous. For all intents and purposes, he at the time is an adversary.

On the side of the road, my objective is to drive away with the car and proceed on my way in the realm of "Agree with thine adversary quckly whilst thou art in the way with him."

It is ALWAYS possible that going to jail is imminent when one does not possess a license. One must first settle the matter in one's mind, because, in the tension of the the traffic stop, the cooler head will always prevail. One must then settle that the only real weapon that the officer has is the threat of jail. If the officer cannot play that card, his control ability is in jeopardy, and he will be at a discretionary disadvantage. The ability to notice this makes all the difference between driving away or having a tow and ride to the nearest jail. I am starting to digress--- until next post...

this is what i'm doing as of now. I live in washington acording to the RCW's if you can prove your not a resident you are not required to have a licence. this is a good cop friendly way to go about things. So I don't own the car, I have insurance progresive insures unlicenced drivers. I am able to properly identify myself as posted above you have to identify yourself or they can arrest you. I just play myself of as a guy just traveling through I have an out of country address and so far they have just said have a nice day. once the cop understands i'm not a resident he just lets me go. again only been pulled over once and all it takes is an ******* to blow things aout of porportion. But realize that you haven't commited a crime if they do arrest you what would they charge you with its all smoke and mirrors.

just what I do
FD