Travel Discuss how to reclaim the right to travel freely, public access, etc.


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  #31  
Old 07-21-2004, 02:30 PM
mrmaw mrmaw is offline
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Privatizing your car

Dear Sir, You need to study your history, if you want to know were yo've been (man in general) and were you are going. The law that ever body on this site keeps quoting and believe in!!!!!!! Is derived from the the Talmud, and it orginated from scripture. When the Yaddaim (Hebrew Priest) stop using the peacefull laws and fell from understanding of those laws of the Torah . That is why they went into captivity, Assyria, i.e. Canaanites (Roman Cathoic Chruch). At that point in time they were not allowed to own proprety, or factories(produce products). So they intergraded into there society, the law and money exchange (Banking). That is when they started implementing there law into the Assyrians law creating the Talmud so they could have commerce with them. They liked this new land because they could forniicate with them, there women first then with there men. As did the Assyrians i.e. Roman Catholics an the Catholics still do it to this day!!!!!! The Catholics worship the sun god and the penus, as did Eygpt. Look at all the capitals of the world, there is a obelisk in every city. In the center then the streets go outward as in a spoke wheel. This is the mark of Cain, Canaanites, Roman Catholics church or anyone that follows there teaching i.e. Xmas, easter. They had to create the Talmud (U.C.C.) so they could interact with them. They still incorporated some of the Torah laws into the Talmud to appease the ones that were still following the righteous laws. They became very wealth and powerful. As are they are today. But they are not the true Hebrew people they lost there understanding of the laws. Most of the lawyers today are jews. The word Jews is a put down like the word niger. They own the media to!! You need to understand were the laws of the land come from. The Talmad is the modern day U.C.C. Don't take my word for it study for yourself. All this forum is doing is enabling us to put them of for a while. You need to understand what this is. The Laws of the first five books (613 LAWS) of the Holy Srciptures allows us to redeem ourselfs. And if you do the resreach you will find that the laws of this land allows us to do the same (U.C.C.). i.e. Talmud, because they are derived from the same source. If you are a student of the law you should know this. But in your defanse I don't think they teach you this in law school. But as you know ignorance of the law is not a defense. You might think this is mumbo jumbo!! It isn't, study to show yourself approved. Come out of her my people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This means the system that was set up by Cain an Nimrod!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You all need to understand this! We are in a very dangerous time. This summer is the began of the end of mans goverment for the people and by the people. Its going to take 3 years from this point. Mt 10:22 And you will be hated above all men for My Name's sake; but he who endures to the end will be saved! Meaning the message that I bring to you this day! You all are my brother. Study to show yoursefl approved!!! Your humble servent.
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  #32  
Old 07-21-2004, 11:28 PM
seizeliberty
 
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Privatizing your car

Check these out:



Speeding Allowed here



Senator's Letter here
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  #33  
Old 07-22-2004, 12:37 AM
The Man The Man is offline
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Privatizing your car

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira
I consider the matter closed.



For HIS Glory,

Akira



Assuming that I would care or live by how you consider matters, good for you.
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  #34  
Old 07-22-2004, 01:29 AM
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weishaupt1776 weishaupt1776 is offline
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Privatizing your car

Yo, "The Man";

I first must say it is an honor(no sarcasm) having you in this forum.

I am curious as to your intent on being here, though. Are you truly concerned for us & really believe we're wasting our time with insufficient data, information, wisdom, & experience?

Do you think it's in all of our best interest to forsake the unchanging Common Law standard of our country in favor of an ever entropic, statutory web of deception weaved by a selfish, power elite?
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  #35  
Old 07-22-2004, 11:18 AM
jmunson
 
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Privatizing your car

Pride cometh before the fall...
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  #36  
Old 07-22-2004, 06:27 PM
Anti-Predator
 
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Privatizing your car -- moved to disc. about Oaths :)

well this has gone way off subject but has been very interesting reading. I post this for anyone to respond to:



Considering how important an Oath is - all public officers, attorneys, etc. must take one before serving, my question here is since Bouvier's Law Dict. 1865 Edition states:



2. It is proper to distinguish two things in oaths; 1. The invocation by which the God of truth, who knows all things, is taken to witness. 2. The imprecation by which he is asked as a just and all-powerful being, to punish perjury.



From reading many oaths of office, I know of no public officer, judge, attorney, etc. that has taken an oath which includes IMPRECATION... therefore the oaths must not be valid ~! ?
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  #37  
Old 07-23-2004, 12:20 PM
The Man The Man is offline
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Privatizing your car

I have also defended a number of lawsuits broughts as collateral attacks on judgments based on what litigants plead as technical faults in the judges oath. I must say in all fairness, I have never had a litigant challenge my oath. As a State's attorney I take two: one oath for the state bar, the other for the attorney general's office. Again, purely historically, these lawsuits have not been met with much success.



The thing is, there is no magic word, no perfect incantation, no secret loophole that allows a person to get out of an obligation by the mere utterance thereof. Trust me, I have seen them all tried. The thing is, the Court system today, for better or for worse, is not very well equiped to handle novel legal theories or modes of argument that don't fit the model as established. We all face frustration when we find rules of law or procedure that are, quite frankly, kind of stupid, time consuming, or just unfair given the particulars of the situation. But, as the zen would say, it is what it is. You can stand before a mountain and scream that its existance within your path is unfair until you are blue in the face. It will still be a mountain, it will still be in the way.



If you want to make real significant change you sort of have a limited universe of options: get your folk elected and change the law from within, pressure the people already in power to make the changes you require, leave, or give in. There is always violent overthrow of the government but I can't reccomend it considering the numbers of people you need and the sacrifices they would need to be willing to make. Plus, to be frank, The Man is dug in, armed to the teeth, and has pretty insanely superior numbers. A loosing strategy on a good day.



To answer the query directly: it may work in your state to challenge the oath of a judicial officer for the missing word you have found but I will tell you that Law Dictionaries do not carry any weight in court. They are just dictionaries. Doesn't matter how old they are, how esteemed they are, or how big they are. I would make up authority for a legal proposition before I quoted a dictionary or a law review article or a Corpus Juris Secundum section.



But hey, what do I know? I only do this for a living....
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  #38  
Old 07-23-2004, 08:20 PM
MinionoftheMAN
 
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Privatizing your car

I am a legitimate Minion of The Man. I really actually work in the basement for the person posting comments under the user name of "The Man." That person is really an attorney working in the lower 48 and is extremely bright. I hardly believe The Man to be on the path that leads to wearing "black dresses." The Man enjoys throwing pro se actions out on their ear, and yes, The Man always wins. To date, The Man has never lost to a pro se complainant.

Briefly, because it requires no more, the string of argumentation suggesting that it is against THE LAW to be required to register your vehicle, is flawed. The right, and it is a right, is to TRAVEL. You will not find case law, of which I am aware, which states that citizens of the USA or others living on North America within the boundaries the majority of the known world accepts as the boundaries of the USA, i.e., all people who feel that they are exempt from the laws of the States or the federal government, have the RIGHT to drive a car. There is no right to drive a car. Travel simply does not equate to using a vehicle on city, county, state, federal, or any other entity's road system. The argument is flawed at that point and it stops there. the judge throws out the case. Chalk another one up for the minionoftheMAN
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  #39  
Old 07-23-2004, 08:35 PM
MinionoftheMAN
 
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Privatizing your car

ps. the two links providing about speeding and something else don't work. very impressive



outdated, expired links to support legal propositions. Do you see why The Man is really not giving your stuff any credence?
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  #40  
Old 07-23-2004, 09:23 PM
TheBlackTruth TheBlackTruth is offline
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Privatizing your car

Quote:
Originally Posted by MinionoftheMAN
I am a legitimate Minion of The Man. I really actually work in the basement for the person posting comments under the user name of "The Man." That person is really an attorney working in the lower 48 and is extremely bright. I hardly believe The Man to be on the path that leads to wearing "black dresses." The Man enjoys throwing pro se actions out on their ear, and yes, The Man always wins. To date, The Man has never lost to a pro se complainant.

Briefly, because it requires no more, the string of argumentation suggesting that it is against THE LAW to be required to register your vehicle, is flawed. The right, and it is a right, is to TRAVEL. You will not find case law, of which I am aware, which states that citizens of the USA or others living on North America within the boundaries the majority of the known world accepts as the boundaries of the USA, i.e., all people who feel that they are exempt from the laws of the States or the federal government, have the RIGHT to drive a car. There is no right to drive a car. Travel simply does not equate to using a vehicle on city, county, state, federal, or any other entity's road system. The argument is flawed at that point and it stops there. the judge throws out the case. Chalk another one up for the minionoftheMAN



MinionOfTheMan, Below is an argument based on case law that supports the soveriegn's unalienable RIGHT to travel in his conveyance of choice on public highways. You can find this in its entirety in the downloads section. I really don't think all of this is even necessary to prove the point. Just read the Constitution for the United States of America and the Bill of Rights.



1. The issue is whether this Sovereign is required to obey the provisions in the state statutes. It is the contention of this Sovereign that because he is a Free and Natural Person who has given up none of his "RIGHTS." That the legislative enactments and statutes do not apply to him. It is also the contention of this Sovereign that travels upon the streets or highways in any state of America by this Sovereign is an unalienable "RIGHT." Being this, is not subject to regulation or legislation by any "State" of the united States.

2. Let us first consider the contention of this Sovereign that travels upon the streets or highways in America is a "RIGHT." Various courts have ruled on this issue. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled:

2.1 The "RIGHT" to travel is a part of the liberty of which the Citizen cannot be deprived without due process of the law under the 5th Amendment. (Emphasis added) See: Kent v. Dulles, 357 U.S. 116, 125

3. The Supreme Court of Wisconsin stated in 1909:

3.1 The term "public highway," in its broad popular sense, includes toll roads -- any road which the public have a "RIGHT" to use even conditionally, though in a strict legal sense it is restricted to roads which are wholly public. (Emphasis added). See: Weirich v. State, 140 Wis. 98.

4. The Supreme Court of the State of Illinois ruled:

4.1 Even the legislature has no power to deny to a Citizen the "RIGHT" to travel upon the highway and transport his property in the ordinary course of his business or pleasure, through this "RIGHT" might be regulated in accordance with the public interest and convenience. (Emphasis added) See: Chicago Motor Coach v. Chicago, 169 N.E. 22



PRIVILEGE OR RIGHT?

6.1 The use of the highway for the purpose of travel and transportation is NOT a mere PRIVILEGE, but a "COMMON AND FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT" of which the public and individuals cannot rightfully be deprived. (Emphasis added) See: Chicago Motor Coach v. Chicago, supra; Ligare v. Chicago, 28 N.E. 934; Boone v. Clark, 214 S.W. 607; American Jurisprudence 1st Ed., Highways 163

6.2 Citizen's "RIGHT" to travel upon public highways includes right to use usual conveyances of time, including horse-drawn carriage, or automobile, for ordinary purposes of life and business. (Emphasis added) See: Thompson v. Smith (Chief of Police), 154 S.E. 579, 580

6.3 The "RIGHT" of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, either by carriage or by automobile, is not a mere privilege which a city may prohibit or permit at will, but a "COMMON RIGHT" which he has under the "RIGHT" to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. (Emphasis added) See: Thompson v. Smith, supra.

7. It could not be stated more conclusively that Sovereigns of the states have a "RIGHT" to travel, without approval or restriction, (license), and that this "RIGHT" is protected under the U.S. Constitution. After all, who do the roadways belong to anyway? The People-At-Large. Here are other court decisions that expound the same facts:

7.1 .... [T]he streets and highways belong to the public, for the use of the public in the ordinary and customary manner. See: Hadfield v. Lundin, 98 Wn. 657; 168 P. 516;

7.2 All those who travel upon, and transport their property upon, the public highways, using the ordinary conveyance of today, and doing so in the usual and ordinary course of life and business. See: Hadfield, supra; State v. City of Spokane, 109 Wn. 360; 186 P. 864.

7.3 The "RIGHT" of the Citizen to travel upon the highways and to transport his property thereon, in the ordinary course of life and business, differs radically and obviously from that of one who makes the highways his place of business and uses it for private gain .... (Emphasis added) See: State v. City of Spokane, supra.

7.4 ...... [F]or while a Citizen has the "RIGHT" to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, that "RIGHT" does not extend to the use of the highways, either in whole or in part, as a place of business for private gain. For the latter purposes no person has a vested right to use the highways of the state, but is a MERE PRIVILEGE or license which the legislature may grant or withhold at its discretion .... (Emphasis added). See: Hadfield, supra; State v. Johnson, 243 P. 1073; Cummins v. Jones, 155 P. 171; Packard v. Banton, 44 S.Ct. 257, 264 U.S. 140 and other cases too numerous to mention.

8. The Washington State Supreme Court stated:

8.1 I am not particularly interested about the rights of haulers by contract, or otherwise, but I am deeply interested in the "RIGHTS" of the public to use the public highways freely for all lawful purposes. (Emphasis added). See: Robertson v. Department of Public Works, 180 Wash. 133 at 139

9. The Supreme Court of the State of Indiana ruled in 1873:

9.1 It is not the amount of travel, the extent of the use of a highway by the public that distinguishes it from a private way or road. It is the "RIGHT" to so use or travel upon it, not its exercise. (Emphasis added) See: ? Ind 455, 461

10. 11 American Jurisprudence 1st, has this to say:

10.1 The "RIGHT" of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, by horse-drawn carriage, wagon, or automobile, is NOT a mere PRIVILEGE which may be permitted or prohibited at will, but a "COMMON RIGHT" which he has under his right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Under this constitutional guarantee one may, therefore, under normal conditions, travel at his inclination along the public highways or in public places, and while conducting himself in an orderly and decent manner, neither interfering with, not disturbing another's "RIGHTS," he will be protected, not only in his person, but in his safe conduct. (Emphasis added) See: 11 American Jurisprudence 1st., Constitutional Law, 329, page 1123

11. The Supreme Court of the State of Georgia ruled:

11.1 In this connection it is well to keep in mind that, while the public has an absolute "RIGHT" to the use of the streets for their primary purpose, which is for travel, the use of the streets from the purpose of parking automobiles is a privilege, and not a "RIGHT"; and the privilege must be accepted with such reasonable burdens as the city may place as conditions to the exercise of the privilege. (Emphasis added). See: Gardner v. City of Brunswick, 28 S.E.2d 135

12. The Supreme Court of the State of Colorado discussed the issue in the following way in 1961.

12.1 The Constitution of the State of Colorado, Article II, §3 provides that:

All persons have certain natural, essential and unalienable "RIGHTS," among which may be reckoned the "RIGHT" .... of acquiring, possessing and protecting property; ....

12.1.1 A motor vehicle is property and a person cannot be deprived of property without due process of law. The term: "property," within the meaning of the due process clause, includes the "RIGHT" to make full use of the property which one has the unalienable "RIGHT" to acquire.

12.1.2 Every Citizen has an unalienable "RIGHT" to make use of the public highways of the state; every Citizen has full freedom to travel from place to place in the enjoyment of life and liberty. (Emphasis added). See: People v. Nothaus, 147 Colo. 210

13. The Constitution of the State of Idaho contains the words:

13.1 All men are by nature free and equal, and have certain unalienable "RIGHTS," among which are ....; acquiring, possessing, and protecting property .... (Emphasis added).

14. The words of the Idaho Constitution are to all intents and purposes identical with those of the North Carolina Constitution. The Constitution of the State of North Carolina, Article I, §1, states as follows:

14.1 The equality and rights of persons. We hold it to be self-evident that all persons are created equal; that they are endowed by the Creator with certain inalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty, the enjoyment of the fruits of their own labor, and the pursuit of happiness.

14.2 To be that statutes which would deprive a citizen of the rights of person or property without a regular trial, according to the course and usage of common law, would not be the law of the land. See: Hoke v. Henderson, 15 N.C. 15, 25 AM.Dec. 677

15. Since courts tend to be consistent in their rulings, it would be expected the Idaho Supreme Court would rule in the same manner as the North Carolina Supreme Court.

16. Other authorities have arrived at similar conclusions:

16.1 The Constitution for the United States of America, Amendment 9:

16.1.1 The enumeration in the Constitution of certain rights shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

17. The Constitution of the State of North Carolina, Article I, §36:

17.1 Other rights of the people. The enumeration of rights in this Article shall not be construed to impair or deny others retained by the people.

18. I demand all of my other rights, including the right to travel upon the public highways and byways in the United States of America.

19. The Constitution of the State of North Carolina, Article I, §2:

19.1 Sovereignty of the people. All political power is vested in and derived from the people; all government of right originates from the people, is founded upon their will only, and is instituted solely for the good of the whole.

20. As member of the Sovereignty of the people, I not only am entitled to use the highways and byways in the United States of America, I have an inalienable right to use the highways and byways.

20.1 Highways are public roads which every Citizen has a "RIGHT" to use. (Emphasis added). See: 3 Angel Highways 3.

20.2 A highway is a passage, road, or street, which every Citizen has a "RIGHT" to use. (Emphasis added). See: Bouvier's Law Dictionary.

21. I have emphasized the word "RIGHT" because it is a common point among the authorities listed. The Idaho Code even joins in this common point:

21.1 49-301 (13) Street or highway. -- The entire width between property lines of every way or place of whatever nature when any part thereof is open to the use of the public, as a matter of "RIGHT," for purposes of vehicular traffic. (Emphasis added.) See: Idaho Code.

22. The United States Supreme Court has ruled that:

22.1 Undoubtedly the "RIGHT" of locomotion, the "RIGHT" to remove from one place to another according to inclination, is an attribute of personal liberty, and the "RIGHT," ordinarily, of free transit from or through the territory of any State is a "RIGHT" secured by the Fourteenth Amendment and by other provisions of the Constitution. (Emphasis added). See: Williams v. Fears, 343 U.S. 270, 274

23. Thus, there can be little doubt that, when this Sovereign travels upon the streets or highways in North Carolina, he does so as a matter of "RIGHT" and not privilege. The authority for such travel is described variously as a "RIGHT," a "COMMON RIGHT," an "ABSOLUTE RIGHT," an "UNALIENABLE RIGHT," and a "RIGHT" protected by the Constitution of the United States. Let us then examine the importance of these terms to this Sovereign by defining their meaning.

23.1 "RIGHT" -- In law,

(a) an enforceable claim or title to any subject matter whatever;

(b) one's claim to something out of possession;

(c) a power, prerogative, or privilege, as when the word is applied to a corporation. See: Webster Unabridged Dictionary

23.2 "RIGHT" -- As relates to the person, "RIGHTS" are absolute or relative; absolute "RIGHTS," such as every individual born or living in this country (and not an alien enemy) is constantly clothed with, and relate to his own personal security of life, limbs, body, health, and reputation; or to his personal liberty; "RIGHTS" which attach upon every person immediately upon his birth in the kings dominion, and even upon a slave the instant he lands within the same. (Emphasis added). See: 1 Chitty Pr. 32.

23.3 "RIGHT" -- A legal "RIGHT," a constitutional "RIGHT" means a "RIGHT" protected by the law, by the constitution, but government does not create the idea of "RIGHT" or original "RIGHTS"; it acknowledges them ..... (Emphasis added). See: Bouver's Law Dictionary, 1914, p. 2916

23.4 Absolute "RIGHT" -- Without any condition or incumbrance as an absolute bond, simplex obligatio, in distinction from a conditional bond; an absolute estate, one that is free from all manner of conditions or incumbrance .. A rule is said to be absolute when, on the hearing, it is confirmed. (Emphasis added). See: Bouvier's Law Dictionary.

23.5 Unalienable -- A word denoting the condition of those things, the property in which cannot be lawfully transferred from one person to another. See: Bouvier's Law Dictionary.

24. It shows from these definitions that the State has an obligation to acknowledge the "RIGHTS" of this Sovereign to travel on the streets or highways in North Carolina. Further, the State has the duty to refrain from interfering with this "RIGHT" and to protect this "RIGHT" and to enforce the claim of this Sovereign to it.

25. Now if this Sovereign has the absolute "RIGHT" to move about on the streets or highways, does that "RIGHT" include the "RIGHT" to travel in a vehicle upon the streets or highways? The Supreme Court of the State of Texas has made comments that are an appropriate response to this question.

25.1 Property in a thing consists not merely in its ownership and possession, but in the unrestricted "RIGHT" of use, enjoyment and disposal. Anything which destroys any of these elements of property, to that extent destroys the property itself. The substantial value of property lies in its use. If the "RIGHT" of use be denied, the value of the property is annihilated and ownership is rendered a barren "RIGHT." Therefore, a law which forbids the use of a certain kind of property, strips it of an essential attribute and in actual result proscribes its ownership. (Emphasis added). See: Spann v. City of Dallas, 235 S.W. 513

26. These words of the Supreme Court of Texas are of particular importance in Idaho because the Idaho Supreme Court quoted the Supreme Court of Texas and used these exact words in rendering its decision in the case of O'Conner v. City of Moscow, 69 Idaho 37. The Supreme Court of Texas went on to say further;

26.1 To secure their property was one of the great ends for which men entered into society. The "RIGHT" to acquire and own property, and to deal with it and use it as the owner chooses, so long as the use harms nobody, is a natural "RIGHT." It does not owe its origin to constitutions. It existed before them. It is a part of the Citizen's natural liberty -- an expression of his freedom, guaranteed as inviolate by every American Bill of "RIGHTS." (Emphasis added). See: Spann supra.

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