Speeding fine - Question for group

[charlesa6]

Karkinos, welcome to the suijuris forum.

[Shoonra]

Originally Posted by Bulletproof Monk

So in reply to your answer: "objection, SMJ and heresay, not admissable".

I'm not sure how you could quibble with jurisdiction except by showing that the alleged traffic offense took place outside the court's geographic jurisdiction. As for hearsay -- you've got a slightly better chance if you spell it right -- I would expect the policeman to appear in court himself to testify, so I don't know what point you're hoping to make.

[Codee]

Originally Posted by Shoonra

I'm not sure how you could quibble with jurisdiction except by showing that the alleged traffic offense took place outside the court's geographic jurisdiction. As for hearsay -- you've got a slightly better chance if you spell it right -- I would expect the policeman to appear in court himself to testify, so I don't know what point you're hoping to make.

Like this SHoonra. In california if there is no formal complaint on the record by the time a defendent pleads not guilty the court is stripped of SMJ and must dismiss the case immediately. The case law on this is insane. I have never once had a foral complain file on a traffic infraction. Your crazy.

Also in California if you get a ticket for violating a posted prima facie speed law and there is no speed survey done for that section of road CERTIFIED copy stamped or original filed into the case jacket the court is stripped of all jurisdiction whatsoever for the charge. The case law on this is insane.

YOU ARE CRAZY. I show lack of jurisdiction ALL THE TIME!!!

Originally Posted by Codee

Like this SHoonra. In california if there is no formal complaint on the record by the time a defendent pleads not guilty the court is stripped of SMJ and must dismiss the case immediately. The case law on this is insane. I have never once had a foral complain file on a traffic infraction. Your crazy.

Also in California if you get a ticket for violating a posted prima facie speed law and there is no speed survey done for that section of road CERTIFIED copy stamped or original filed into the case jacket the court is stripped of all jurisdiction whatsoever for the charge. The case law on this is insane.

YOU ARE CRAZY. I show lack of jurisdiction ALL THE TIME!!!

Codee, would you be so kind as to clairify "SMJ"?
Thanks.

[Codee]

Subject Matter Jurisdiction!

[Bulletproof Monk]

Well, my ticket, and the original conditional acceptance, my full acceptance, and some other stuff, and a letter saying this is not an acceptable method of payment has arrived...This is the 5th time now..

Here's the letter:

Dear Sir,

On behalf of the Commissioner of Police, I acknowledge receipt of your correspondence regarding Expiation Notice No.......

As previously advised, your notice of conditional acceptance can not be accepted, and it is not a valid form of payment.

You retain the right to either expiate the notice in full prior to the due date (by the way this keeps moving forward 14 days every time I get one of these letters) or elect to have your submission considered by court. Should you wish to take up the second option please complete the appropriate section of the notice and return it to this Branch prior to the final date for payment. The matter will then be processed for prosecution and a summons issued enabling you to have your submission considered by an independent arbiter.

To Expiate this notice, please ensure payment of $266 is made on or before the due date on the attached advice slip. I do not intend to correspond with you further in relation to this matter. The due date for payment will not be extended further.

Any suggestions??

Bulletproof

[charlesa6]

Originally Posted by Bulletproof Monk

Well, my ticket, and the original conditional acceptance, my full acceptance, and some other stuff, and a letter saying this is not an acceptable method of payment has arrived...This is the 5th time now..

O yea once in a while you will come across pesistence law dog, who want something different.

Here's the letter:

Dear Sir,

On behalf of the Commissioner of Police, I acknowledge receipt of your correspondence regarding Expiation Notice No.......

As previously advised, your notice of conditional acceptance can not be accepted, and it is not a valid form of payment.

You retain the right to either expiate the notice in full prior to the due date (by the way this keeps moving forward 14 days every time I get one of these letters) or elect to have your submission considered by court. Should you wish to take up the second option please complete the appropriate section of the notice and return it to this Branch prior to the final date for payment.

The matter will then be processed for prosecution and a summons issued enabling you to have your submission considered by an independent arbiter.

You can hang this matter for long time if you want to without any succeed on their part. Yes. I like that let them issue the summons. You can do R4C or do your adminisrative remedy, before you face the blackrobe, and tell him what you want him to do for you and close the case.

To Expiate this notice, please ensure payment of $266 is made on or before the due date on the attached advice slip. I do not intend to correspond with you further in relation to this matter. The due date for payment will not be extended further.

No can do.

[mrg]

I do not know how things work in Australia.

(And I may be off base or wrong.)

[Shoonra]

Assuming the system works the way the traffic court systems in the US that I've seen...

Expatiate (which is used here in a Very unusual way) means that you send in the fine, thereby effectively pleading guilty or at least No Contest, and thereby avoid having to show up in court.

If you don't send in the fine by the deadline, you are expected (required!) to show up in court on the date specified.

And sending in the fine means paying it in a conventional way, that will, with minimum effort on the part of the traffic dept, turn into real money; e.g., a genuine bank check or money order, not the sort of promissory notes or bills of exchange I have seen touted on this website.

[Bulletproof Monk]

Expiate also means "to atone for" and is a religious concept whereby god forgives me for a sin..

Go figure..??

The "ticket" as such is merely a green notice, I didn't sign anything, he just handed it to me and left.

It starts with "It is alleged that.."

I've already done 2 conditional acceptances, a notary stamped letter of dishonour, a notary stamped full acceptance, and also stamped the original notice, plus a letter of negative averment..

I think I have to just send it back "without recourse" at this point..

Bulletproof